STEAM TRAMS : is there much interest for them on here?

[trammayo]

I have always liked steam trams - particularly British ones - and the fact that my home town of Leeds had two major manufacturers (Thomas Green and Kitson). I used to write articles for an "in-house" magazine under the nom-de-plume of M.K.Green (Merryweather Kitson Green).

My adopted city (of Bradford), had two distinct 4ft gauge systems. I think, the one that escaped to South Africa (Kimberley) and is preserved in its' rebuilt form, came from the Bradford Tramways & Omnibus Company. I had some tools, including an anvil, from that company. Hopefully they are in the care of Bradford's Industrial Museum.

It was regauged to 3'6".

 

[Miamigo259]

The Cambridge horse tram we are currently restoring was actually a trailer used on the Bradford & Shelf Steam Tramway at one stage of its rather varied career. It started off on Bath Tramways and ended up at Cambridge, where it was withdrawn in 1914 when the horse cars were replaced by motor buses....



It is identical to the type used in Ipswich, so we aquired it as none of our cars survived. Its going back into Cambridge livery and the new running gear is to 4' gauge, as opposed to the 3'6" used in Ipswich.

 

[Miamigo259]

There is also a (Diesel I think) replica of a J70/Y6 on the Severn Valley, I last saw it in a road with a bunch of Wagons at Bewdoey. Anyone have a picture of it to post?

Was it this ghastly looking thing.....?



This was parked at Quorn & Woodhouse on the GCR on one of my visits there in 2008. I think it might still be there - dumped in the sidings at Swithland.
God knows what plans they used to make it as the proportions are all wrong!
Presumably manufactured by "Sheds R Us" or some similar concern..........

 

[dunnyrail]

The Cambridge horse tram we are currently restoring was actually a trailer used on the Bradford & Shelf Steam Tramway at one stage of its rather varied career. It started off on Bath Tramways and ended up at Cambridge, where it was withdrawn in 1914 when the horse cars were replaced by motor buses....

View attachment 231587

It is identical to the type used in Ipswich, so we aquired it as none of our cars survived. Its going back into Cambridge livery and the new running gear is to 4' gauge, as opposed to the 3'6" used in Ipswich.

Will it get used on the proposed Cambridge Light Rail, judging by Gov Budget Cuts that would be a cheaper option, return Horse Trams!

 

[dunnyrail]

I have always liked steam trams - particularly British ones - and the fact that my home town of Leeds had two major manufacturers (Thomas Green and Kitson). I used to write articles for an "in-house" magazine under the nom-de-plume of M.K.Green (Merryweather Kitson Green).

My adopted city (of Bradford), had two distinct 4ft gauge systems. I think, the one that escaped to South Africa (Kimberley) and is preserved in its' rebuilt form, came from the Bradford Tramways & Omnibus Company. I had some tools, including an anvil, from that company. Hopefully they are in the care of Bradford's Industrial Museum.

It was regauged to 3'6".

Pity I cannot read the yellow label, if that has a Works Number on I may indeed be able to confirm it’s origin. Nice to learn of a potential survivor of a UK Steam Tramway, Bradford was indeed 4ft Gauge, this lead to the famous Gauge changing cars (Electric) in later years when services between Bradford and Leeds (4’8.5”) ran through. Now that would have been something in a Steam Tram.

 

[dunnyrail]

Was it this ghastly looking thing.....?

View attachment 231588

This was parked at Quorn & Woodhouse on the GCR on one of my visits there in 2008. I think it might still be there - dumped in the sidings at Swithland.
God knows what plans they used to make it as the proportions are all wrong!
Presumably manufactured by "Sheds R Us" or some similar concern..........

Could be not sure, not quite so ghastly as you think. It is heavily based on the Y6 (0-4-0) Tram, Toby of Audrey fame was based on a J70 (0-6-0). It is a creditable effort with perhaps the use of a Ruler borrowed from LGB. Indeed most of the GE Steam Trams do look somewhat like Garden Sheds. My thoughts about a repo were to use an old Brake Van on top of an Industrial Steam Loco. If I win Euro Millions perhaps that is what I will do!

 

[Gizzy]

Will it get used on the proposed Cambridge Light Rail, judging by Gov Budget Cuts that would be a cheaper option, return Horse Trams!

Nah, it'll be way too tall to use on the Mis-Guided Busway south of the main railway station!

Only single decker buses can pass under the Hills Rd overbridge, as the Busway was built along the old Varsity line alignment, and alongside the existing tracks to Liverpool St and Kings Cross.

The northern section of the Busway, was built on the old railway alignment from Milton to St Ives. The 'track' was lowered where it passed under any road over bridges so that double decker buses can use it....

 

[Paul M]

Could be not sure, not quite so ghastly as you think. It is heavily based on the Y6 (0-4-0) Tram, Toby of Audrey fame was based on a J70 (0-6-0). It is a creditable effort with perhaps the use of a Ruler borrowed from LGB. Indeed most of the GE Steam Trams do look somewhat like Garden Sheds. My thoughts about a repo were to use an old Brake Van on top of an Industrial Steam Loco. If I win Euro Millions perhaps that is what I will do![/QUOTE
Very odd looking, but serviceable, and obviously practical for their job. Much better than a lorry or misguided bus!

 

[Miamigo259]

Could be not sure, not quite so ghastly as you think. It is heavily based on the Y6 (0-4-0) Tram, Toby of Audrey fame was based on a J70 (0-6-0). It is a creditable effort with perhaps the use of a Ruler borrowed from LGB. Indeed most of the GE Steam Trams do look somewhat like Garden Sheds. My thoughts about a repo were to use an old Brake Van on top of an Industrial Steam Loco. If I win Euro Millions perhaps that is what I will do!

For contrast, a picture of one of the real ones on New Cut East in Ipswich docks.............

 

[dunnyrail]

For contrast, a picture of one of the real ones on New Cut East in Ipswich docks.............

View attachment 231596

Sorry to be pedantic but that is a J70 0-6-0 I still say that the garden Shed one is a Y6. For comparison purposes here is a very early pic of a Y6. Note that the Tramway Coaches were considerably lower than the Loco.


The J70’s had curvy skirts whereas a Y6 had straight ones as in this pic. To the best of my knowledge the Y6’s never ran sans skirts as did the J70’s as in your pic at Ipswich I think. To be fair to you it does take a very trained eye to differential between the two. J70 with curvy skirt in place, probably on the Wisbech and Upwell line.

 

[Miamigo259]

It would be a J70 at Ipswich as that appears to be what was based here from 1902 when the first ones were built.....
https://www.lner.info/locos/J/j70.php
A Y6 was recorded as working here in 1923, but that appears to be the only mention of one.....
https://www.lner.info/locos/Y/y6.php
Whilst all the dockside lines were classed as "Tramways" and should have been worked by locos with enclosed motion, I have seen photos (certainly in BR days) of at least one ex GE 0-6-0T with a set of coupling rods removed to enable it to traverse the sharp curves near Coprolite Street.
The remaining J70's were eliminated by the 11500-11502 batch of 0-4-0 Hunslet diesels that arrived in 1954, being followed by what were later classes 04 & 03 0-6-0's. All of the ones used on the dock lines continued to have enclosed motion right up to the early 1970's when the requirement appeared to have been dropped.

The 1981 version in action..........

 

[Miamigo259]

One preserved example I have ridden behind is the Canterbury Tramway Company 1881 built Kitson that lives at the Ferrymead Heritage Park near Christchurch, NZ.

Even got a footplate ride on it as well! (a bit cramped...)

 

[3Valve]

Another Vid of some English NOW Steam Trams. One I was aware of at Telford now Horsehay, the other at Far Ings Farm that was entirely new to me. Just goes to show you do not know what you do not Know! Also,on this delightful vid some other views of recent Steam Trams from other parts of the globe.

I was just going to comment that the "Telford Town Tram" featured in the vid is still in use but it appears that it was taken out of service in Apr 2017 until further notice. Damn shame.

https://telfordsteamrailway.co.uk/attractions/telford-town-tramway/

 

[dunnyrail]

This link will take you more details of the South African Loco ‘Beaconsfield’.

http://steam-locomotives-south-africa.blogspot.co.uk/2009/07/blogentry-2009-07-12-01.html

 

[dunnyrail]

I visited Switzerland with Andy Rush and the other builder of the Ruschbahn Chris Mountain in March 2017. amongst the many places we visited on the so called 'Rusharound' was Luzern Railway Museum a superb Museum well worth a visit in the locality. Secreted within is this superb Steam Tram together with it's Trailer Car, I believe another similar to this is preserved and works on occasion on the Bern Tram System.

 

[trammayo]

This link will take you more details of the South African Loco ‘Beaconsfield’.

http://steam-locomotives-south-africa.blogspot.co.uk/2009/07/blogentry-2009-07-12-01.html

H'mm, it does contain some factual errors!

 

[dunnyrail]

H'mm, it does contain some factual errors!

Can you enlighten us please Mick with relevant references to the true facts?

 

[trammayo]

Well, the first thing is that the loco came from the Bradford Tramways and Omnibus Company (for whom it was built) and not Bradford Corporation Tramways. I have some notes somewhere. I'll dig them out.

 

[Miamigo259]

Spotted this one whilst looking through my photos this afternoon for something else..........



The photo was taken at the BHEV Museum in Szentendre, Hungary (near Budapest) in May 2002.
The loco dates from 1887

 

[Paul M]

Spotted this one whilst looking through my photos this afternoon for something else..........

View attachment 231784

The photo was taken at the BHEV Museum in Szentendre, Hungary (near Budapest) in May 2002.
The loco dates from 1887

Strange looking beastie, any more pictures?