Hi, Tim, best of luck! I have a DCC set up here for the large scale railway (not the tramway) Hornby Elite plus a Bachmann booster;- works OK but my system is not fully compatable with anyone else!!! Alyn
The torture begins - first decoder installation - Massoth 'L'
- Thread starter Tim Brien
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Alyn,
you are a glutton for punishment. If I had a 'stand alone' system that others could not assist with then I would give up. I remember the early days of MTS advertising, no fancy wiring required, simply attach two wires to the track and you are ready to go.
you are a glutton for punishment. If I had a 'stand alone' system that others could not assist with then I would give up. I remember the early days of MTS advertising, no fancy wiring required, simply attach two wires to the track and you are ready to go.
Tim Brien said:
I remember Hornby "Zero 1" too! Mind you, I only have two wires to my line, except for two more to each of the return loops. Oh and two more for each point motor...
Well, it seems mistake #1. The Massoth chip only recognises the whistle sound from the LGB factory sound unit, whether in serial or parallel. A LGB decoder would have read all the sounds available. Apart from starting and standing sounds, the only functions available are whistle and lights. Even though the prototype did not have a bell, the LGB literature states that bell, German words, etc., should be available. I was lead to believe the Massoth chip was better. Maybe not when factory sounds are concerned.
Tim,
I dont understand what you mean by the decoder "reading" all the sounds available.
However, I suspect you need to activate the "Fast Serial pulse chain" function of the A1 output. This will then let the decoder send pulses to the sound unit to tell the sound unit which sounds to play when you issue the relevant "Fkey" on your handset.
To do this set CV49 to value 11.
I dont understand what you mean by the decoder "reading" all the sounds available.
However, I suspect you need to activate the "Fast Serial pulse chain" function of the A1 output. This will then let the decoder send pulses to the sound unit to tell the sound unit which sounds to play when you issue the relevant "Fkey" on your handset.
To do this set CV49 to value 11.
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Tim Brien said:
Which is, of course, generally true IF you buy their ready-to-run equipment, ie: factory-chipped locos; it's only when you start installing chips yourself that it starts to get a little bit more complicated, but then I think that is true of any modification that you do yourself. Since I went MTS (and then to Massoth) I've chipped maybe a dozen locos, all of which have worked fine for me - maybe I've just been lucky! Sure, there have been a few little quirks and things to sort out, especially with the very old split-gearbox locos, but I have always kept in mind the fact that I'm trying to retrofit twenty-first-century technology into a model built in the 1970s. I will admit that the one thing I've NOT yet tried to do (because I haven't needed to on any of my locos) is to fit a driving decoder to a loco already fitted with factory sound, as you are doing with your U class - mostly I've been fitting sound decoders to older analogue locos.
Hang on in there, Tim - there is an answer to almost every question, and the end results will be more than worthwhile!
Jon.
CV 49 to value '11' did the trick. My 'U' lok is now ready to button up. Many thanks as I would not have known where to look for this info. I assumed the LGB type 2 decoder, if fitted, would have automatically selected the sound function. Now I can think about my other locomotives to chip. Hopefully less drama(?)
Compatibility of dcc and analogue is certainly varied. The only engines I have that perform identically with sound and motion on both are factory fitted QSI and LGB. The types of variation I've seen are: ESU have a delay from starting to the sound starting in dc, I expected this from what I read and was told by their site which is why the default suppress sound when put on dc, (unless you enable it by cv). Qsi get round this by using 0-5 volts to power everything up whike the others manufacturers seem to treat motor and sound as separate issues. LGB sound boxes perform erratically on dc with Gaugemaster controllers but not LGB ones. Certain Massoth sound decoders perform erratically on dc, see Neils thread on fitting Massoth chips to Genesis Amtrak locos.
For dc operation if all the onboard electronics are bypassed and motors and lights are all connected directly, which is a lot more work admittedly, then it seems to at least remove any erratic motion though sounds may not be fully synchronised.
I'm moving towards standardising on one make of decoder and only expect full features on dcc.
For dc operation if all the onboard electronics are bypassed and motors and lights are all connected directly, which is a lot more work admittedly, then it seems to at least remove any erratic motion though sounds may not be fully synchronised.
I'm moving towards standardising on one make of decoder and only expect full features on dcc.
Paul,
the 'U' lok is synchronised (Hall effect I assume) with two chuffs per revolution. I have been playing with LGB digital sounds for a few years fitted to analogue locomotives and have played around to get chuff synching to wheel initial movement. Chuff always within one-quarter revolution (CV synching, not magnets or pulse sensors).
My modified LGB #23191 undec Mogul with LGB #65001 steam sound performs beautifully on DCC. The synching by CV manipulation gives me four chuffs per revolution at low speeds where I typically run. Unfortunately, the downside is chuff 'runaway' as speed/voltage increases. I can live with the runaway as I always run steam locomotives very slow. DCC has transformed the Mogul.
the 'U' lok is synchronised (Hall effect I assume) with two chuffs per revolution. I have been playing with LGB digital sounds for a few years fitted to analogue locomotives and have played around to get chuff synching to wheel initial movement. Chuff always within one-quarter revolution (CV synching, not magnets or pulse sensors).
My modified LGB #23191 undec Mogul with LGB #65001 steam sound performs beautifully on DCC. The synching by CV manipulation gives me four chuffs per revolution at low speeds where I typically run. Unfortunately, the downside is chuff 'runaway' as speed/voltage increases. I can live with the runaway as I always run steam locomotives very slow. DCC has transformed the Mogul.
Tim there might be a way of getting four chuffs on the U as well. On the Harz sound locos you can add 64 to the value of cv54 to make it four rather than 2 chuffs per revolution.
(Pages 9 & 11 of the pdf not the booklet)
http://www.champex-linden.de/lgb_pr...C2190585256F46005A4FC6/$FILE/2181x_102004.pdf
(Pages 9 & 11 of the pdf not the booklet)
http://www.champex-linden.de/lgb_pr...C2190585256F46005A4FC6/$FILE/2181x_102004.pdf
Paul,
the problem I think will be that the LGB factory sound is possibly not a decoder. I had read with the Massoth pulse generator about varying chuff dependent on the number of magnets selected. No doubt the hall sensor in the 'U' lok is a Massoth item, but not sure if the factory sound can read it as such. I have a feeling that it is like a reed switch type pulse sensing, i.e., only two pulses per revolution. If I knew that it had a decoder in the sound board then it definately would be possible. The 'U' lok travels so slowly that four chuffs would be an advantage.
the problem I think will be that the LGB factory sound is possibly not a decoder. I had read with the Massoth pulse generator about varying chuff dependent on the number of magnets selected. No doubt the hall sensor in the 'U' lok is a Massoth item, but not sure if the factory sound can read it as such. I have a feeling that it is like a reed switch type pulse sensing, i.e., only two pulses per revolution. If I knew that it had a decoder in the sound board then it definately would be possible. The 'U' lok travels so slowly that four chuffs would be an advantage.