No Standing Sounds On LGB F7A-B

AlanL

AlanL

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1 Mar 2016
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I'm wondering if someone could help resolve of the standing sounds issue with my LGB Santa Fe F7A-B.
They are the blue versions, model numbers 20576 and 20586.

All the sounds work fine but as soon as the locomotive comes to a stop, the sound of the engine idling ceases.

My first question is is this correct? I've had the locomotive from new (around 2012) but can't remember if this is normal.

My feeling is that this is not normal because all of my other locomotives stand with the engine idling or steamers with the fireman shovelling coal etc.

So, I'm hoping that it will be a case of altering a CV in the B unit but there is no mention of a relevant CV in the instruction book.

Any suggestions anyone?

Alan
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
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Alan,
Give us a clue..
What do the function keys control, that you know of? :think:

This will tell us if it is factory-fitted, or later, and we can make informed suggestions..

PhilP
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Northampton
Phil,
I've had these A and B units from new and therefore the circuit boards are the original LGB. The function keys will be as ex factory, can't remember them all, but I can remember F1 is the horn and F4 is the station announcement.

Alan
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
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I will have a little 'dig', but would suggest perhaps the loco engine has not been started?

For a start, you could try F5, F6, and F8. - I will go-check, but think F6 may well be engine stop/start, F8 sound off/on, F5 might be a 'funny' on a diesel. - It would be standing sounds on a steamer..

PhilP.
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Northampton
This loco doesn't have the option to 'start the engine'. I think that that is a feature of the Massoth XLS boards. It only has F8 - sound on or off. When the loco is moving, the engine sound is there. When stopped, instead of an idling engine, the sound just stops.
Perhaps this is normal, I honestly can't remember.
If anyone else has this A B combination perhaps they could confirm whether the idling engine sound ceases when the locomotive is stationary.

Alan
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Phil, thanks to your question about function keys, I tried them yesterday. None of the keys 1 to 8 worked. Key 9 worked the lights. Track magnets operate the horn and bell sounds fine and I believe that the reed switches for these are on the B unit.

So my theory is - that as the sound board is in the B unit, that receives all its power and instructions via the inter-connection cables, the problem is most likely due to a cable problem. I'll have a look later today.

Alan
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Checked the cables, replaced the cables with some spares but I still have the problem. Next step will be to open the loco's and check connections inside.
 
PhilP

PhilP

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5 Jun 2013
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Alan, what control system are you using?
Can you also try pressing the F1 key a couple of times in succession..

PhilP.
 
AlanL

AlanL

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I'm using Massoth system. Pressing F1 multiple times has no effect.
Had a look inside both units yesterday and check and re-made all connections.

I noticed that the 'B' unit has an axle sensor and it is this that is giving the units the sounds. (starting sound and engine speed that increases with speed.)
The 'B' unit also has the reed switches and these trigger the appropriate sounds when they pass over a track magnet.

So, do I still have a CV set incorrectly ? Or do I have a faulty decoder or a faulty sound board?

I'm slightly curious to swap either a decoder or a sound board with a working locomotive to find the culprit.

I'm also lazy and might just live with the problem and justify it by saying that the driver of the locomotive is an environmentalist who likes to shut down the engine when at rest :)
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
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Tamworth, Staffs.
I have seen an installation where the loco would sit silently.. Then if you moved the throttle a step, or two, it would 'wake-up' and go through a start-up sequence.. It would then sit idling, but if you did nothing else, it would go through a shutdown, after about 30 seconds.

Perhaps try just moving off 'zero' a speed-step or two? - pause after each step, to see if the loco starts. ..

PhilP.
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Northampton
The sounds from the 'B' unit start as soon as the wheels turn. So with the 'A' unit uncoupled but connected electrically, pushing the 'B' unit starts the engine sound. That's with the controller on zero, the axle sensor on the 'B' unit starts the sound.

Alan
 
idlemarvel

idlemarvel

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I think there's a setting which says at which voltage to start running sounds. I had a problem the inverse to yours where a steam loco would chuff even when stopped. (This was without an axle sensor.) Adjusting that value upwards meant the chuffs didn't start until the loco moved. If you can find that value (sorry no manual to hand at the moment) and set it to one below your start voltage value CV2 that might keep the sound going even though the loco has stopped.

EDIT: the CV in question is CV 194 (trigger threshold for sound output), try setting it to one less than CV 2 (starting voltage)
 
Last edited:
Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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Alan, I think you need the optional cap bank plugged in to get standing sounds (and it only runs until the power in the caps is exhausted)

Can you shoot a picture of the inside of the B unit to be sure of the electronics? There should be an open connector for the super cap bank.

Here I am talking DC, but maybe you are asking on DCC?

Greg
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Dave, this loco has a standard (old) LGB motor decoder and I don't think that there is an option to select the sounds. The CV's only go to the nineties. The loco has a separate sound board in the 'B' unit and I'm not sure if there are any CV's to apply to the sound board. This is unlike for example Massoth XLS decoders that enable many combinations of settings that can be tweaked.

Alan
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Greg, I'm running DCC using Massoth, but your suggestion answers my original question regarding standing sounds in that they should remain with the engine idling when the locomotive is stationary.

This loco has had this issue for a few years now and I've only just decided to investigate the problem. It doesn't affect normal running. I select the loco, give it some speed steps and the loco sounds the starting sounds and runs normally. Track magnets trigger the appropriate sounds.

During the course of this thread I've discovered that none of the F-key sounds work (I obviously don't use them very much). To me, that implied a connection issue between the 'A' and 'B' units but I was unable to locate a fault.

Any suggestions would be welcome but otherwise I'll live with the problem until the decoder eventually dies.

Alan
 
idlemarvel

idlemarvel

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13 Jul 2015
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Dave, this loco has a standard (old) LGB motor decoder and I don't think that there is an option to select the sounds. The CV's only go to the nineties. The loco has a separate sound board in the 'B' unit and I'm not sure if there are any CV's to apply to the sound board. This is unlike for example Massoth XLS decoders that enable many combinations of settings that can be tweaked.

Alan
Sorry I assumed wrongly from post #5 that Massoth XLS decoders were involved. I see now you were referring to them in general not for this situation in particular.
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Northampton
Greg, yes exactly the same. I fortunately took a photo of the board when I had it apart to check the connections.

Alan
 
AlanL

AlanL

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Northampton
The connections for the B unit are exactly as your photo. The A unit decoder connections, as far as I remember have never been touched. But I have repaired a broken connection to one of the motor blocks.

Alan