LGB 2022x Allegra [External Link]
- Thread starter muns
- Start date
Philbahn, I am curious to know if you can read the CV's with the Massoth or LGB programming software. BTW, it's OK to have both front and rear pantos up at the same time--the real one does that when going up steep grades or when it needs more current.
Hi Keith , read them on the programming track using the outlet at the back of the z1200. That is the last 2 terminals on the right as you look at the back of the z1200.
Then on the Navigator onto read cv's . once i had got them I re-entered the decoder setting mode and entered the settings. as aboue posting
Then on the Navigator onto read cv's . once i had got them I re-entered the decoder setting mode and entered the settings. as aboue posting
Thanks Phil, another question for you: How does the brake squeal work? Does F7 make it squeal when you push the button or does it also automatically make the sound when you slow down the way normal LGB sound locos do and the F7 just enables/disables that?
Keith
Keith
You are right you just enable and disable the squeal and when it slows down it engages . I think! Only tried it on a very short length of track
Also noticed after yesterday's comment about switching the sound off that after it goes off andyou start it going the sound comes back on
Also noticed after yesterday's comment about switching the sound off that after it goes off andyou start it going the sound comes back on
Following on from this, and referring to the analogue 20220 set, with Massoth decoder..
I do not seem to 'see' a large number of the CV's once downloaded with the Massoth software. - I can read them individually, but they do not appear in the overall CV listing within the software.
The programmer only appear to read certain CV's, and I presume this is controlled by the 'template' for that particular model of decoder??
I have updated the programmer software, but I might need to remove the lot and start again. - I have always had a problem in the software starting up in German for a start.
The software always seems to display the first two digits of the firmware, so if you program an XLS and the update tool reports 'upgraded to version 2.83' the Programmer software will only report this as version 2.80 .
I am having trouble logging into the Massoth Forum at the moment, but will query this there.
I do not seem to 'see' a large number of the CV's once downloaded with the Massoth software. - I can read them individually, but they do not appear in the overall CV listing within the software.
The programmer only appear to read certain CV's, and I presume this is controlled by the 'template' for that particular model of decoder??
I have updated the programmer software, but I might need to remove the lot and start again. - I have always had a problem in the software starting up in German for a start.
The software always seems to display the first two digits of the firmware, so if you program an XLS and the update tool reports 'upgraded to version 2.83' the Programmer software will only report this as version 2.80 .
I am having trouble logging into the Massoth Forum at the moment, but will query this there.
PhilP said:
What CVs are you not seeing?
PhilP said:
Correct, there is a template for the XLS decoder which tells the software which CVs to read and what to display on each of the panels in the software.
PhilP said:
The latest version of the DCC Programmer is 1.2.48.0. This version has the ability to perform an online update and it will download updated versions of itself and updated/new templates as they become available.
PhilP said:
This has always been the case as the firmware revision in CV7 has always been represented as two digits, i.e. 26 for versions 2.6x
PhilP said:
I can read the individual CV values from within the programmer software, but they do not appear in a listing (not in template) and are not written because of this, I presume??
Tomorrow, I will work-out why I am unable to get into the Massoth forum and quiz them on this.
Tomorrow, I will work-out why I am unable to get into the Massoth forum and quiz them on this.
Philbahn said:
I would like to thank everyone for their contributions to this topic which I have found fascinating.
With regard to the full size RhB 3 car Abe 8/12, my understanding is that the center car pantograph is used on the Stammnetz (11kV 16.7Hz north of Pontresina). On the Bernina line (1kv DC) the driving car pantographs are used, both pantographs when the load requires. Once upon a time, one of my tasks was to calibrate the transductor Voltage sensing circuits for the dual Voltage (6.25 and 25kV, both 50Hz) AM/3 electric multiple units (later BR class 303 'Blue trains'). Technically its much simpler to switch transformer primary tappings so a single pantograph and the automatic Voltage sensing circuits were adequate. Using separate pantographs for dual AC and DC operation is a more elegant (cheaper, reliable) engineering solution.
So if you have never heard of Rule#8 (eternal thanks to Mike) you should operate with the center pantograph on DCC but either (or both) outer pantographs on analog
Mr Spock (of Star Trek fame, 'illogical, Captain') would be bemused by LGB not choosing servo operation of the AC pantograph on DCC!
Don
16.7Hz..?
Now there is a very precise choice..
I would love to know the reason(s) for choosing such a low frequency. - Though it is 1/3 of 50Hz..
My brain is now trying to work out if there is a way to get this from a 3 phase 50Hz supply, and a clever use of transformers. It's a long time since I worked any theory like that!
Now there is a very precise choice..
I would love to know the reason(s) for choosing such a low frequency. - Though it is 1/3 of 50Hz..
My brain is now trying to work out if there is a way to get this from a 3 phase 50Hz supply, and a clever use of transformers. It's a long time since I worked any theory like that!
I can't claim any personal knowledge of the reason for 16.7Hz but I have been told it was reduce the synchronous speed of AC motors (3000rpm for 2 pole at 50Hz). With a four pole motor at 16.7Hz, the speed is down to a more practical 500rpm. Multi pole motors are relatively expensive and I'm not sure if the electric motor technology in the 1920s was sufficiently advanced. It's likely that mechanical limitations did not allow (relatively) high speed reduction gearboxes in those days.PhilP said:
However I suspect that the real reason was to match the generators to the low speed turbines in the hydro power stations. 16.7Hz is the Swiss Federal Railways standard and the railway hydro stations are separate from the general public power system. The same technology regarding poles, frequency and synchronous speed applies to generators and certainly mechanical limitations even more so.
I believe there is a theoretical way of frequency changing using a passive (transformer) circuit but in practical power applications, frequency changers tended to be motor generator sets until electronic power ratings increased to allow rectifier / inverter solutions. Switched mode power supplies are usually far cheaper now than transformers for consumer devices, as well as smaller and far lighter.
Incidentally modern offshore oil installations in the UK North Sea often operate at 60Hz. This allows smaller lighter generators and motors making a significant cost saving in the structure. Again for weight reduction, some aircraft systems operate at 400Hz. Technology has moved on since the Swiss ran out of economical fossil fuel in the early 20th century and hydro electric power was the solution. Whither the next 100 years?
Thanks for the extra information..
It makes sense if they have their own HEP generation, and use that frequency.. I to thought you could make smaller, lighter units if a higher frequency was used. Was aware of 400Hz in aircraft, though I believe they use a 'weird and wonderful' plug/socket and that there are pins with both DC and AC in the same shell/connector. - You wire-up according to the 'flavour' of power the device needs.
Always interesting to see how others have done things.
It makes sense if they have their own HEP generation, and use that frequency.. I to thought you could make smaller, lighter units if a higher frequency was used. Was aware of 400Hz in aircraft, though I believe they use a 'weird and wonderful' plug/socket and that there are pins with both DC and AC in the same shell/connector. - You wire-up according to the 'flavour' of power the device needs.
Always interesting to see how others have done things.
Phil,
Have you got access to the 'grey programming cable' at all?
Want to work-out if I can knock something up for the analogue version (with a Massoth XLS) without opening it up every time..
So far, I have a cable I can plug onto the headers inside..
Many thanks,
PhilP.
Have you got access to the 'grey programming cable' at all?
Want to work-out if I can knock something up for the analogue version (with a Massoth XLS) without opening it up every time..
So far, I have a cable I can plug onto the headers inside..
Many thanks,
PhilP.
Phil will get it later on
In the mean time
Cv 1- 3 address 144- 255
2- 10 153-255
3- 5 176-255
4- 5 177-255
5- 255 257-1
13- 22 263-16
14- 1 272 -12 (altered to 4
17- 192 280-64
18- 128 285-16
19- 0 288-128
21- 0 293-4
22- 0 300-32
29- 6 Suggest this should be 4 for lgb control
50- 2 305-128
53- 255 308-32
54- 16 315-2
55- 32 321-1
56- 48 326-4
60- 43 331-8
63- 255 336-2
64- 255 348-16
138- 255 353-16
139- 255 357-2
140- 255 363-16
141- 255 368-8
143- 255 372-12 (altered to 8)
380-64
385-16
389- 1
393-4
400-32
405-128
408-32
415-2
421-1
426-4
431-8
436-2
In the mean time
Cv 1- 3 address 144- 255
2- 10 153-255
3- 5 176-255
4- 5 177-255
5- 255 257-1
13- 22 263-16
14- 1 272 -12 (altered to 4
17- 192 280-64
18- 128 285-16
19- 0 288-128
21- 0 293-4
22- 0 300-32
29- 6 Suggest this should be 4 for lgb control
50- 2 305-128
53- 255 308-32
54- 16 315-2
55- 32 321-1
56- 48 326-4
60- 43 331-8
63- 255 336-2
64- 255 348-16
138- 255 353-16
139- 255 357-2
140- 255 363-16
141- 255 368-8
143- 255 372-12 (altered to 8)
380-64
385-16
389- 1
393-4
400-32
405-128
408-32
415-2
421-1
426-4
431-8
436-2
So Phil it looks like your list matches the default list with the exception of CV 353. The default value for that one is 64 according to the last page of the decoder manual. The difference is that the way yours is set it triggers sound 1, while 64 triggers sound 3.
Keith
Keith
Hi Keith think that has to do with the magnetic reed switches on one of the bogies on the centre car. I only found that they were fitted yesterday