Hi all I’m a complete noob here!

Daniel Collett

Daniel Collett

New to the choo choo
29 Dec 2019
9
1
33
Dorset, England
Hello all. Just joined your fantastic forum and already need help.
So have always had the good old Hornby 00 trains and finally taken the big step to “G” gauge!
I have bought myself off of eBay (no doubt off of someone who is a member of this forum), an LGB Lehmann Stainz 0-4-0 20212 no.2774. So at present I have the loco and nothing else, no track, transformer etc. A complete g gauge virgin! So to begin, I can find plenty of information on Lehmann and LGB but no manual or instructions for my little loco. I think it’s one of the more modern ones with the round speaker in the roof, but am unsure if it has a smoke system? As no switch underneath at front. Looking down the funnel it looks like a smoke gen, but not sure. There is a three position switch at the fire door in cab. It’s also missing it’s driver which I would like to replace.
so any help with instructions on what to buy (track, starter kits, spares, transformer, etc) and pdf manual would be massively appreciated.
Dan.
 

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Paradise

Registered
28 Jan 2010
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Welcome aboard Daniel, please take a seat! :)

I have the 20212 Stainz which is probably the same as yours. The modern version with plastic rods. I was under the impression mine did not have smoke but the thread below indicates that it is on all the time so must be the higher voltage smoke unit that only smokes when going fast. LGB LOCO - Can you tell if it has a smoke generator - G Scale Central
The early Stainz locos with smoke have the stack secured by a nut underneath which has a contact in the centre with a metal lever adjacent that swings sideways to make contact acting as an electrical switch.
The inside switch is for the sound and turning the loco completely off so it remains stationary.

If you buy a transformer/controller, get at least a 1 amp one like the LGB 50080. It will work OK for a small layout with only a few cars. Running two motor locos with sound, smoke and lots of cars may need up to 10 amps or more.
Some others that come in sets are only half an amp and a bit too small and only good for very minimal requirements. If you are currently on a budget a 12 volt one from a HO set will be OK to get things going but not the best.

R1 track sections are easily to come by. 12 in a circle. Most of the other brands like AristoCraft are compatible although Peco G45 track code 250 can have a few issues but still possible to use. The rail code is the rail height in thousandths of an inch. LGB rail is code 332 which suits LGB's deep wheel flanges.

Here are some LGB manuals below but the 20212 is not listed. It is likely to be similar to other Stainz locomotives. Go fish.
Lgb service manuals - Model Train Forum - the complete model train resource

Product referance
GartenBahn DataBase

I hope this helps to get things going.
 
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dunnyrail

dunnyrail

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25 Oct 2009
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Welcome Dan, you will find that a modest 1 amp power supply will allow you to test run your Stainz to see how it performs. You could even put a couple of sets of 00 Track in a line at 45mm apart to test it though it would likely bump along on the sleepers. But as LGB is so robust no harm will occur.

Assuming that you may eventually be going into the Garden a decision re Track will be looming. I have been using mostly Peco G and find it near perfect, though depending on space you may find that the curves in the points (4ft Radius) make them quite large but very nice to look at. Perversely the only curves they do are LGB R1 equivalent.

If you go for LGB or similar Track do not be put off by buying second hand, that applies to all track as it is all pretty robust and extensive exposure to the outside just tarnishes the rails somewhat. Here the LGB Track Cleaning Block ref 50040 is your best friend for Track Cleaning. Also works well for 00 Track. If you can I would caution about choosing LGB Radius 1 (ref 11000), Radius 2 is much better (ref 15000) but LGB do not do R2 points so R3 are better than R1. A look through this site will give you some idea of Track Availability as new.


good luck with your journey with the big stuff, have a look at my links below to show some of what can be achieved given time.
 
Daniel Collett

Daniel Collett

New to the choo choo
29 Dec 2019
9
1
33
Dorset, England
Welcome aboard Daniel, please take a seat! :)

I have the 20212 Stainz which is probably the same as yours. The modern version with plastic rods. I was under the impression mine did not have smoke but the thread below indicates that it is on all the time so must be the lower voltage smoke unit that only works when going fast. LGB LOCO - Can you tell if it has a smoke generator - G Scale Central
The early Stainz locos with smoke have the stack secured by a nut underneath which has a contact in the centre with a metal lever adjacent that swings sideways to make contact acting as an electrical switch.
The inside switch is for the sound and turning the loco completely off so it remains stationary.

If you buy a transformer/controller, get at least a 1 amp one like the LGB 50080. It will work OK for a small layout with only a few cars. Running two motor locos with sound, smoke and lots of cars may need up to 10 amps or more.
Some others that come in sets are only half an amp and a bit too small and only good for very minimal requirements. If you are currently on a budget a 12 volt one from a HO set will be OK to get things going but not the best.

R1 track sections are easily to come by. 12 in a circle. Most of the other brands like AristoCraft are compatible although Peco G45 track code 250 can have a few issues but still possible to use. The rail code is the rail height in thousandths of an inch. LGB rail is code 332 which suits LGB's deep wheel flanges.

Here are some LGB manuals below but the 20212 is not listed. It is likely to be similar to other Stainz locomotives. Go fish.
Lgb service manuals - Model Train Forum - the complete model train resource

Product referance
GartenBahn DataBase

I hope this helps to get things going.
Paradise thank you for the reply. Yep mine definitely does not have the bolt type stack nor the contact switch underneath. What is the correct oil/ fluid for the smoke generator. Don’t want to purchase any large or expensive quantities as it might not work/or definitely even exist.
thanks again.
dan
 
Daniel Collett

Daniel Collett

New to the choo choo
29 Dec 2019
9
1
33
Dorset, England
Welcome Dan, you will find that a modest 1 amp power supply will allow you to test run your Stainz to see how it performs. You could even put a couple of sets of 00 Track in a line at 45mm apart to test it though it would likely bump along on the sleepers. But as LGB is so robust no harm will occur.

Assuming that you may eventually be going into the Garden a decision re Track will be looming. I have been using mostly Peco G and find it near perfect, though depending on space you may find that the curves in the points (4ft Radius) make them quite large but very nice to look at. Perversely the only curves they do are LGB R1 equivalent.

If you go for LGB or similar Track do not be put off by buying second hand, that applies to all track as it is all pretty robust and extensive exposure to the outside just tarnishes the rails somewhat. Here the LGB Track Cleaning Block ref 50040 is your best friend for Track Cleaning. Also works well for 00 Track. If you can I would caution about choosing LGB Radius 1 (ref 11000), Radius 2 is much better (ref 15000) but LGB do not do R2 points so R3 are better than R1. A look through this site will give you some idea of Track Availability as new.


good luck with your journey with the big stuff, have a look at my links below to show some of what can be achieved given time.
Thanks for the reply. A lot of letters and numbers there to digest. Think I need to read up on track. Never realised so many options exist. What wold be your go to track for a noob looking to buy a simple set up to get going, but future proof for compatibility when it all gets a bit more serious, as it no doubt will. Thanks
Dan
 
JimmyB

JimmyB

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23 Feb 2018
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Daniel Collett Daniel Collett welcome to the forum, I have a couple of Stainz, but am by far an expert, mine is also 20212 like P Paradise , however mine does not have smoke, as no smoke generator is fitted, and I don't think one was fitted when new (to mine). The issue with second hand (and all mine are) is it is not always easy to see what the pedigree is, but with a little perseverance good running locos can be achieved from ebay bargins.
 
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Paradise

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28 Jan 2010
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Dan, do you intend to run your trains 'Draußen oder drinnen' (inside or outside)? ;)
That may determine what radius track you should use. R1 set track is good for limited spaces inside but if out in the great outdoors a larger radius is much better and more realistic. If a permanent outdoor set-up flex track may be better too with fewer joins and more gradual curves. If you go that way, any R1 you may buy first may not get used.
 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
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Thanks for the reply. A lot of letters and numbers there to digest. Think I need to read up on track. Never realised so many options exist. What wold be your go to track for a noob looking to buy a simple set up to get going, but future proof for compatibility when it all gets a bit more serious, as it no doubt will. Thanks
Dan
Despite my comments on Radius I guess that most of us started with a loop of LGB R1 and a few short straights. That will give you some testability and play, once you get outside you could use larger Radius if you have space and just keep that original loop as an indoor testing circuit.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
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1,092
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Welcome Daniel!
Yes, lot's of number's, but no-worse than a catalogue of Hornby/Peco track-items! ;)

Buying track:
It does not matter how 'filthy-black' it is, it will still be usable, and none will really go to waste. - Unless it has been really mangled in it's life.
The joiners, may be a different matter! - They get bent, and tarnished (inside and out) so can be a little problematic, for good continuity for track-powered running.

Don't get too carried away, when buying secondhand, especially off EvilBay.. It is all too easy to spend more on a secondhand item, then the item cost's new! - Always remember to include postage costs.
We all end-up with lot's of R1 curves. - All LGB stock is designed to run on these, but other makes of rolling-stock and loco's may not cope so well.
Larger loco's (and stock) can look a little silly, going round these tight curves, but if it is all you can fit into your space, then go with it.

By choice, I would aim for LGB's R3 as a minimum. - This might seem extravagant, but will look better, and allow you more choice of stock to run later.

You will not do wrong with a smallish transformer, to start with. - It can always be used to test things on the bench, without stripping things from the 'mainline'.

Do think about where you want to go with your railway.. Do you want an 'express mainline' with sweeping curves? - Hope you have a big garden! ;)
A bucolic English branch-line? - Small loco's, a few wagon's, or a couple of coaches.
Are there any junior member's of the family? - Grand Kid's are a great excuse for buying things! :):nod::nod:

Spend some time on the Forum. Don't neglect threads featuring Playmobil. This is rugged. Can be cheaper, and can free your spirit to 'play and enjoy' a little.


But, most important of all:
Get a bit of track-down, and play-trains!

Enjoy!
PhilP.
 
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Paradise

Registered
28 Jan 2010
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Daniel Collett Daniel Collett welcome to the forum, I have a couple of Stainz, but am by far an expert, mine is also 20212 like P Paradise , however mine does not have smoke, as no smoke generator is fitted, and I don't think one was fitted when new (to mine). The issue with second hand (and all mine are) is it is not always easy to see what the pedigree is, but with a little perseverance good running locos can be achieved from ebay bargins.
JimmyB. I thought the same but after investigation due to this post I now think mine does have smoke. I can see the glint of brass through the chimney screen under the light. I guess the screen should pop off somehow. Read this link. LGB LOCO - Can you tell if it has a smoke generator - G Scale Central
 
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Paradise

Registered
28 Jan 2010
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125
Smoke oil. LGB make smoke oil which is also a cleaning oil. It comes in an 8 fluid oz square plastic bottle SN:50010 or small squeeze packets which usually come in sets.
Try getting a small packet for testing. I think with this smoke unit which is always on, it will not work very well unless going a non prototypical speed. The novelty may wear off. I don't bother myself.
 
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JimmyB

JimmyB

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P Paradise as I have converted this to battery, l know mine currently does not have smoke, but who knows how it originally started out!
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

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27 Oct 2009
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Thanks for the reply. A lot of letters and numbers there to digest. Think I need to read up on track. Never realised so many options exist. What wold be your go to track for a noob looking to buy a simple set up to get going, but future proof for compatibility when it all gets a bit more serious, as it no doubt will. Thanks
Dan
The perceived wisdom when considering track radius is to 'go large' - as large as your garden (or other space) will allow. It's one of the few bits of advice that I have heeded in my life, and I'm glad I listened to someone who knew.

Otherwise, I think the best advice is to get playing with the trains; get something down quickly, then your instincts will tell you how, when or if you want it to grow.
 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
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in truth smoke systems are a bit of a gimmick, I have even stripped out the fancy fan operated systems from 3 of my TraiLine Locomotives. These do have a central reservoir for longer smoke runs with the 7ml of fluid that they hold. Not sure how long that will last, but I get worried about flooding the inside electrical circuitry with the fluid so never use the,
 
Daniel Collett

Daniel Collett

New to the choo choo
29 Dec 2019
9
1
33
Dorset, England
firstly thank you everyone for making me feel so welcome. I have literally spent the day researching the LGB scene!
so my plan as it stands. A simple R1 circle for testing and to go round the Christmas tree and for indoor play. However, I completely understand the unrealism of larger locomotives and rolling stock on a tight radius, but as I currently only have a Stainz, I don’t think it will look too bad. I am fortunate enough to have a large garden for which I think an R3 with FLEXI wold be the better option. I’m still getting to grips with the compatibility side of things, so for now I will just stick to everything LGB Lehmann until I understand a bit more. Plus and I really don’t intend to offend, but the larger American loco’s aren’t my flavour anyway.
As for smoke generator, I’m almost sure it has the low voltage system that’s constantly on, however time will tell if it actually works. On another note. Has anybody considered e-cig oils. They can produce good smoke with relatively low currents/voltages and are generally harmless once burned compared to refined oils??? Just a thought.
Still sticking a little on the transformer though.
thanks again
Dan
 
Paul2727

Paul2727

Registered
5 Jun 2018
248
55
England
"Looking down the funnel it looks like a smoke gen, but not sure. There is a three position switch at the fire door in cab. It’s also missing it’s driver which I would like to replace.
so any help with instructions on what to buy (track, starter kits, spares, transformer, etc) and pdf manual would be massively appreciated.
Dan."


Hi Dan,
Try these links:

[/URL]

The 22212 is the same as the 20212's that were sold as part of a starter set.
Your smoke unit will be 16 -22 V. So will not work properly at 12v. There is a low voltage replacement smoke unit that has a circuit board to allow it to be used but with the advantage of smoking at a lower voltage.
I have several of these locos as well as some of the older type with the smoke unit built into the funnel.
Chances are that you loco has been apart at some time if the driver figure is missing. (Their arm hangs out of the cab. making it a bit of a pig to get the cab off. ) You may find that there is still a pair of boots glued to the cab floor. (The glue was apparently flexible when new, but hardened over time resulting in the figure breaking off at the ankles at maintenance time.
If you want one , message me and I'll sent you one gratis.
Regards,
Paul.
( Somewhere in Derbyshire.)
 
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Paradise

Registered
28 Jan 2010
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That's a good explanation of the two different smoke oil unit voltages and how they work. I muddled that up. :think:
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
25,005
1,092
Tamworth, Staffs.
Funnels and smoke:
You can GENTLY! ease the grill off the top of the stack with a small screwdriver..
Thin-nose pliers should then allow you to hold the central metal-bit in the smoke unit, and ease it out of the stack. - Be gentle, if it will not come, the wires are either trapped or too short..
If it is an original unit, the colours of the wires will tell you it's voltage:
Black and White - 5V
Both Grey - 19V to 24V

As you are analogue, ignore any further posts, concerning CV values, at this time! ;)
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
26,683
1,069
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so my plan as it stands. A simple R1 circle for testing and to go round the Christmas tree and for indoor play.
thanks again
Dan

Oh no, more stainz on the carpet :tmi::tmi::tmi:
 
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