Trainline45 R2 points

Ralphmp

Ralphmp

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To simplify some layout modifications I'm considering buying some Trainline45 R2 points. These need to be electrically operated so the "out of the box" motorised points seem to be the most suitable option (Supplier Refs 1020962 right hand, 1020952 left hand).

Unfortunately, I can't seem to find any English language description or instructions for these points, and my German skills aren't great when it comes to technical documentation. I tried Google Translate but this wasn't ideal (although it did rather charmingly translate part of the German description as "Polarization of the heart: You can also polarize the heart. We offer you the set polarization (ArtNo 1,020,030)." - I think what's being talked about here is "frog" rather than "heart"?)

So I'd be interested to know if anyone has experience of installing and using these points, especially with a DCC system such as Massoth or LGB MTS.

Thanks in advance
 
Yes I have Phil.

I set up mine on my MTS II system with help from Whatlep (Peter), but I didn't power up the frog. My German isn't too clever either, so Peter's assistance here was very helpful.

I've also found Brian of Glendale Junction helpful, as he is the UK dealer for TrainLine....
 
Thanks Gizzy. That's good to know.

Did you have any issues installing the points with LGB track or do they simply slot in ok?

Thanks again
 
Ralphmp said:
Thanks Gizzy. That's good to know.

Did you have any issues installing the points with LGB track or do they simply slot in ok?

Thanks again
Click to expand...

The arc angle of the points is less than the 30 degree of the R1 points; I think it is 22.5 but I can't be sure as all my track was taken up for a pending house move. (Edited, they are 22.5 deg according to the Glendale website)

http://www.glendalejunction.co.uk/TL45BrassPoints.html

So I had to make a small filler piece of track to make it work on an R2 Curve.

The fishplates are quite short compared to LGB, but they do mate together reasonably well and I had no running issues with the point.

I did like the slow motion action of the point blades, compared to the clunk of the LGB point motors. One thing I did find out, is that you can't fit a LGB motor to these, so I brought the TL motor later, but this shouldn't concern you if you are buying points already fitted with the TL ones....
 
Picture of my R2 point on the R2 curve, before I had to lift the track.

I have circled the 7.5 deg filler piece of track that I had to cut in....d13667eb70ea491182cc183ef6a7108e.jpg
 
Last edited:
Thanks again. Looks like these are the way forward for my modifications.

Will keep you posted.

Best wishes
 
As Gizzy briefly touched on, the only issue with connecting TL45 track to LGB is the joiners (fishplates) - the TL45 ones are shorter, to accommodate the fact that their track is designed so that there is an equal sleeper gap at track joins (as opposed to LGB which has a wider sleeper gap at every rail joint). Simply, a TL45 joiner will fit perfectly onto LGB track piece, but the corresponding LGB joiner will not go onto the TL45 side because the sleeper is too close to the end of the rail; it's a very easy fix, either replace the LGB joiner with a TL45 one at each place the two makes are joined, or just remove all the joiners and use rail clamps.

Jon.
 
"Polarization of the heart"

You sure you didn't buy a DEFIBRILLATOR ::)
 
The frog is called Herzstueck in German, literally translated as 'heart piece'.

Had a look on their German and USA sites and could find no manuals.
 
In case you didn't already know - TL45 R2 is 900mm (3 ft) radius and LGB R2 is 750mm (2ft 6") radius.
The nearest match to TL45 R2 is PIKO R3 at 920mm radius but the Arc is different. PIKO is 12 sections for a circle and TL45 is 16 sections per circle. I am using all of the above at the moment including TL45 R2 points. They all work together fine except for the joiner issue as mentioned above. My fix was to cut down the lgb/Piko joiner (about 5mm) to match the TL45 one. I am using PIKO point motors on my TL45 points but DC only at present. Hope this is useful.
 
Gardenbahner said:
In case you didn't already know - TL45 R2 is 900mm (3 ft) radius and LGB R2 is 750mm (2ft 6") radius.
The nearest match to TL45 R2 is PIKO R3 at 920mm radius but the Arc is different. PIKO is 12 sections for a circle and TL45 is 16 sections per circle. I am using all of the above at the moment including TL45 R2 points. They all work together fine except for the joiner issue as mentioned above. My fix was to cut down the lgb/Piko joiner (about 5mm) to match the TL45 one. I am using PIKO point motors on my TL45 points but DC only at present. Hope this is useful.
Click to expand...

Another point to be aware of is the track centres for 2 TL R2 points in a cross over configuration is 140mm, whereas LGB R1 points is 165mm. This is very tight!

http://www.glendalejunction.co.uk/TL45TrackPlan.html

Confusingly, LGB, Piko and TL all have different distances for their radii, unlike 00 Hornby and Peco which use the same measurements for theirs?

Shame the G scale manufacturers can't standardise their geometry....
 
GRS offer points which match the radius of LGB R2 (2 foot 6inch)

http://www.grsuk.com/G45_LH_POINT_RAD_2FT_6_INS_LGB_R2-M4955

Not cheap though...
 
Quick update - I've gone for the Trainline points.

The fact they're not an exact match to LGB R2 curves isn't a problem, and as I generally remove the fishplates on points and use rail clamps for easier maintenance, the different fishplate length is also not an issue for me.

Gizzy - I'm intrigued by the comment you can't fit LGB motors to the TL points. As far as I can see from bench testing, the motors slot in fine and there doesn't seem to be any issues of binding or the LGB motor having a different throw from the TL point bar. Maybe TL have revised the design to make the fitting of LGB motors achievable?

Best wishes
Phil
 
Hi..think I`ve posted these pix before....

I made up two short adaptor pieces from an original LGB R2 curve..
here you can see another LGB R2 curve overlaid on the T/L point + adapter

tline_R2_points.jpg



And here is how they look, LGB R1 is inner, with T/L and LGB on the outer. The geometry isn`t perfect, but given the slop with sectional LGB track..it works well.



Malcolm
 
Ralphmp said:
Gizzy - I'm intrigued by the comment you can't fit LGB motors to the TL points. As far as I can see from bench testing, the motors slot in fine and there doesn't seem to be any issues of binding or the LGB motor having a different throw from the TL point bar. Maybe TL have revised the design to make the fitting of LGB motors achievable?
Click to expand...
Hullo Phil,

I could physically fit the LGB motor to my T-L point, but try as I might, I just could not get the throw right as it was too short. The point blades seem to be closer together on the T-L point compared to the LGB ones? Maybe I have an older version of the point. I did buy it second hand from another forum member.

So I brought the T-L motor from Glendale in the end and had no further issues. In the end though it was a good solution for me, as the T-L motor is fully DCC, so no need to purchase a separate decoder for the LGB motor....
 
Further to Malcolm's posting:

He kindly did these modifications for me. Both points have been in regular use outside since he made the adaptors. One is on a four ended - three train - shuttle branch line and is in constant use.

You can fit an EPL drive, add on switch and lantern to these and they work well and reliably, although i elected not to make the lantern rotate. I used one pole of the add on switch to switch power to the track that was in use and the other pole to switch power to the metal frog nose of the point, although that is optional.

I would thoroughly recommend them and would certainly buy more if I needed that geometry.

James
 
Fortunately I use Air for Point Operation, TL45 no problems whatsoever. Though the older ones do take a bit of thinking about for Live Frog Operation and all are a bit 'Bumpy' this is due to the gap between the Wing Rail and the Frog causing a bit of a dip. I have a solution and will post when my WiFi is back up n running.
JonD
 
Gizzy said:
Hullo Phil,

I could physically fit the LGB motor to my T-L point, but try as I might, I just could not get the throw right as it was too short. The point blades seem to be closer together on the T-L point compared to the LGB ones? Maybe I have an older version of the point. I did buy it second hand from another forum member.

So I brought the T-L motor from Glendale in the end and had no further issues. In the end though it was a good solution for me, as the T-L motor is fully DCC, so no need to purchase a separate decoder for the LGB motor....
Click to expand...

Gizzy - Thanks for expanding on the issue and good to hear you've got a good solution. I'll do some bench testing to see if I've similar issues with throw. Out of curiosity, did you use the DCC address the TL motor came with or did you reprogramme it (and if so, what did you use to update the address CV)?

Brixham - the photos of the "adapter track" are very helpful; thanks for posting.

Best wishes
Phil
 
I have to say that, so far as TL45 R3 points are concerned (and I guess what I'm about to say applies equally to R2), I have found that, after 3 years of use, the manual points are not at all reliable: the rivet that secures the blade to the stretcher becomes detached and I cannot find a workable solution, and the manual point machine disintegrates in that the switch knob collapses into the casing and will no longer move the rack attached to the blade. Out of 9 TL45 manual points, this has now happened to 5 of them. Electrification of the points might solve the collapsing mechanism issue, but it won't solve the blade issue. This is a real pity as for the first two years,the TL points seemed very attractive. Having wasted £££ on the TL version, and being unwilling to pay Thiel prices(or buy LGB R3s which come only in electric form...),I've used Aristo R3s - whether they will survive any better we shall see...
 
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