I'm really pleased with Split-Jaw over-the-rail clamps I have but they're double the price of the same model Piko clamp. Has anyone noticed a difference between the two that would prevent buying the Piko over the Split-Jaw?
Rail Clamps
- Thread starter trailsideGguy
- Start date
Several advantages of the SJ over the Piko: (only considering the direct to rail clamps, do not use the over the joiner clamps)
- the angled cut is less stressful when tightented than the square notch in the Piko, the common example was the Hillman clamps. the 2 square corners are subject to cracking, as tightening the Piko tries to spread the groove open. Many Hillmans failed over time.. the Split jaw has no such proclivity.
- The split jaw allows more close alignment of rails. i have Aristo track bought over many years, and the rail profile has changed some. Also bending rail can put twist in it. The SJ design allows fine tuning to get it perfect.
- I have not used the recend Piko ones, but the Hillmans would wedge themselves onto the foot of the rail and were difficult to remove. No such issue with the SJ
- It appears, but i have not verified, the SJ uses a larger diameter screw, stronger, and less likely to bend when overtightened.
- Buy made in the USA products !!!
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Split-jaw clamps are difficult to find in the UK, although I do have some. I find them a little more fiddly to fit with having 3 pieces?
But they work fine. I also have Massoth, Piko, Hillman and other makes, dependent on what I could get at the time!
And it took me a long time to clamp up all my track too....
But they work fine. I also have Massoth, Piko, Hillman and other makes, dependent on what I could get at the time!
And it took me a long time to clamp up all my track too....
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Appreciate the input. It sounds like "you get what you pay for" is in play here as it does in so many other products. Plus, I do like supporting American manufacturing whenever possible!
It is good to know however that in a pinch other makes will work.
It is good to know however that in a pinch other makes will work.
the split jaw inherently clamps on the bottom outer edge of the rail, clamping harder does not damage the clamp
vs hillman below... notice that as the pressure increases, you force the upper part up. I don't have a closeup of the Piko, but I have thrown away a number of hillmans where the top part bent up... a large percentage cracked over time.
vs hillman below... notice that as the pressure increases, you force the upper part up. I don't have a closeup of the Piko, but I have thrown away a number of hillmans where the top part bent up... a large percentage cracked over time.
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Available in the US are the Massoth pattern direct to rail clamps Massoth 8100150 Rail connector G-gauge (50/Pack) I use them extensively, as well as Hillman over joiner/direct clamps. Like the SJ they are angled to grip the foot of the rail. Unusual in using a pan head machine screw to secure one side of the foot of the rail. Very easy to loosen and slide off if you need to do maintainance work on a section of track, e.g. switch/crossing. Much copied/rebranded. The only problem I ever had with a Hillman was one broken socket head screw, should have lubricated before fitting and leaving out for 10 years of British weather. Max
You pays your money, you makes yer choice. And you get what you pay for. Not as sophisticated as the SJ but they do the job.
You pays your money, you makes yer choice. And you get what you pay for. Not as sophisticated as the SJ but they do the job.
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to keep this thread on topic, the OP stated:
I'm really pleased with Split-Jaw over-the-rail clamps I have but they're double the price of the same model Piko clamp. Has anyone noticed a difference between the two that would prevent buying the Piko over the Split-Jaw?
I am just contrasting the two, PER THE REQUEST OF THE OP.
Did not say Piko was bad, just inferior to the SJ.
Then someone wants to tout Massoth, which was NOT THE ORIGINAL QUESTION
And I believe they are also inferior to SJ.
Answering what the OP asked.
Not saying anything BAD, just not as good...
everyone is taking it to the extreme, their favorite is not the BEST... forgetting just answering the OP's question... he asked if there is a difference that would make him buy the Piko over the SJ?
The only reason is to save money...
Greg
I'm really pleased with Split-Jaw over-the-rail clamps I have but they're double the price of the same model Piko clamp. Has anyone noticed a difference between the two that would prevent buying the Piko over the Split-Jaw?
I am just contrasting the two, PER THE REQUEST OF THE OP.
Did not say Piko was bad, just inferior to the SJ.
Then someone wants to tout Massoth, which was NOT THE ORIGINAL QUESTION
And I believe they are also inferior to SJ.
Answering what the OP asked.
Not saying anything BAD, just not as good...
everyone is taking it to the extreme, their favorite is not the BEST... forgetting just answering the OP's question... he asked if there is a difference that would make him buy the Piko over the SJ?
The only reason is to save money...
Greg
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I have used Hillman over fishplate and no fishplate, also Massoth no fishplate types as Max so superbly phoned. For my money I prefer Massoth, they are much easier to fit as Max says. I find I do not need to clean the base of the rail using Massoth as the screw cleans its own contact area when tightening. As for tightening I have as yet had no issues with the Massoth ones but broken a few screws on Hillman Over types as the clamps tighten the go out of square thus stressing the screws. I have never had any power failures with any type other than when I forgot to tighten the relevant clamp at all, easy forgotten when laying a lot of track.
Oh I have used Hillman on Peco track as well with but not over type clamp no issues. However I have had problems with PECO Massoth Clamps, the ones I got did not clamp the rail till I places a small washer on each screw that then had to be manipulated on top of the base of the rail, quite tedious. I have not heard of anyone having this issue, I have mentioned it before and even Glendale was surprised when I demonstrated the issue to them in the shop.
These days outside I do not need clamps being dead rail, but they are all still in place and any revisions are dutifully clamped up as I feel the clamps help keep track nicely in place and are a good security idea. How could a scally walk down the street with a 100 foot length of rail under 1 arm?
Oh I have used Hillman on Peco track as well with but not over type clamp no issues. However I have had problems with PECO Massoth Clamps, the ones I got did not clamp the rail till I places a small washer on each screw that then had to be manipulated on top of the base of the rail, quite tedious. I have not heard of anyone having this issue, I have mentioned it before and even Glendale was surprised when I demonstrated the issue to them in the shop.
These days outside I do not need clamps being dead rail, but they are all still in place and any revisions are dutifully clamped up as I feel the clamps help keep track nicely in place and are a good security idea. How could a scally walk down the street with a 100 foot length of rail under 1 arm?
Is this the same split-jaw that went out of business a few years ago!!
I find there are 4 basic types of clamps, those like the Massoth ones, and 3 clamp types, over fish-plate, straight to rail and split, i.e. 2 halves on one side, however, it is very difficult to tell who makes a specific clamp unless you buy them new, as manufactures' names are not always apparent. I have some of each type, and even they differ due to different makers.
My Masoth clamps do not look like Max's a different screw, but came in a Massoth packet, though I have some of that type as well. Failures, yes I have had a couple, but most of my clamps are second hand, and I do not know their history, e.g. has some ham-fisted gorilla over tightened them,
Greg Elmassian
I assume you torque yours to ensure the correct tightness is applied.
As we appear to have drifted into rail benders as well, I have a Massoth one with PECO G track rollers. It bends both rails with the rail in the sleepers and works very well indeed. Lucky second hand purchase in GRS. One day I should get some 332 rollers for it.
Rail creep with screw tightening, what on Earth is that? Never had that issue on probably 4-500 feet of clamped rail.
Rail creep with screw tightening, what on Earth is that? Never had that issue on probably 4-500 feet of clamped rail.
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Actually no. I read a recent article about the new owner who noted SJs demise and found the name was abandoned also, so they started a new company. They claim to make a better product.
I will just stick with the connector's that come on the LGB tracks. No extra money spent and no need to worry about which clamp, how tight, difficulty of installation, etc. They are plenty tight and if they get loose a pair of pliers can tighten them with a simple squeeze. You guys are major leaguers though so I can appreciate your discussions.
I really cannot justify why I have 2 dual rail benders, but it's really helped smooth out curves, and they clear the SJ joiners, helps to get the custom bends all the way to the end of the track section. I do enjoy "smooth" track.
The first picture is a bit foreshortened, the two switches in the foreground are #6, "more gentle" than an LGB R5 switch (they have a #5 frog)..
The first picture is a bit foreshortened, the two switches in the foreground are #6, "more gentle" than an LGB R5 switch (they have a #5 frog)..
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Zman: I was looking for zero track maintainence, and I use track power, and several of my trains will draw close to 10 amps on the grade, so low resistance at the joints was imperative. Also, because of my very tight space restrictions, I chose sectional track, which yields many more joints.
So with these restrictions, quality clamps is a must. My average in about 850 feet of track is one loose joiner every year to year and a half. I paid a fair amount to get what I determined to be the best (for MY requirements) and have succeeded.
So, while the stock brass joiners are ok, they don't meet my standards for "just keep working". Also since I have stainless steel track, those stock joiners are terrible, the Aristo design is awful, made worse by the stainless steel not being able to be formed as closely to the rail. You squeeze one of these, and it squeezes back ha ha!
Greg
So with these restrictions, quality clamps is a must. My average in about 850 feet of track is one loose joiner every year to year and a half. I paid a fair amount to get what I determined to be the best (for MY requirements) and have succeeded.
So, while the stock brass joiners are ok, they don't meet my standards for "just keep working". Also since I have stainless steel track, those stock joiners are terrible, the Aristo design is awful, made worse by the stainless steel not being able to be formed as closely to the rail. You squeeze one of these, and it squeezes back ha ha!
Greg
