Massoth Feedback Module "Mode"

[Ralphmp]

The manual that comes with the Massoth Feedback Module mentions 2 modes of operation - "Flank" and "Level" (paras 2.2.1 and 2.2.2 in my manual). Having read this a few times, I'd appreciate it if someone could confirm I've understood the 2 modes correctly.

My interpretation is that

• in Flank mode, the Feedback Module only processes a signal from an attached Track Contact when the contact is moved from an "open" to a "closed" state - e.g. by a passing magnet-fitted loco. If the loco passes over a contact that's already in the closed state, the Track Contact will move to the open state but the Feedback Module will ignore any signal from this state change.

• In Level mode the Feedback Module will act on signals received from the Track Contact moving both from closed to open and open to closed.

Assuming I've got this right, then this should mean that in Flank mode, the Feedback Module will only react every other time a magnet-fitted loco passes over it. e.g. if the contact is in the open state at the start of operations, then the Feedback module will react when a magnet-fitted loco passes over it on the 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, etc. occasions as this is when the contact moves from open to closed. (On the 2nd, 4th, 6th, etc. occasions the passing of a loco will move the contact from closed to open.)

However, if the Feedback Module is in Level mode, then it will react every time a magent-fitted loco passes over it. Using the same scenario as above (contact open at start of operations) then

• on pass 1, when the passing loco triggers the closing of the contact, a "b" signal is received by the Feedback Module,
• on pass 2, when the passing loco triggers the opening of the contact, an "a" signal is received by the Feedback Module,
• on pass 3, when the passing loco triggers the closing of the contact, a "b" signal is received by the Feedback Module,
• on pass 4, when the passing loco triggers the opening of the contact, an "a" signal is received by the Feedback Module,
• etc., etc.

(Sorry if this reads like some mad professor's quantum physics theory - I tried several times to make it as simple as I could...)

Could some kind soul confirm my understanding or tell me where I've gone wrong?
Many thanks!

 

[Deleted member 1986]

By definition these are most likely to be NO types, ie Normally Open, no circuit.......when a magnet is briefly brought into contact with a reed switch it then becomes closed, ie now the circuit is complete, remove magnet, reed switch reverts back to NO, Normally Open.

So in basic terms for Flank Control, when reed switch in NO state DO nothing,.......when reed switch closes by passing a magnet over it, now in closed position..........DO something...........send signal back to Feedback Module and then DO action as setup by the User.

For Level control, if reed switch in NO state, DO something ie "b" scenario, if reed switch closed, ie "a" scenario DO something else....................

By default all will be in NO state, and therefore can only carry out actions in Level Control for "b" scenarios. Flank Control and Level Control "a" scenarios can only be actioned when a magnet is brought briefly within the vicinity of the reed switch to close it.

Massoth version is a Hall Sensor type, no moving parts, works in exactly the same way as conventional glass reed switches.

NC Normally Closed reed switches work in reverse to NO type reed switches.

Then there is of course serious ways to complicate the issue, Relays, Microcontrollers, the Massoth Automatic System, whilst it's geared towards Accessory Addresses, it can only handle Loco Functions that are already setup for Forward/Reverse, it can't directly address Functions, without the addition of an extra microcontroller.........best leave it at that, probably eyes swivelling in heads at this point!

As demonstrated at last year's GRAIL..............Automatic, Train, Point, Signal and 8FS control........

 

[muns]

Phil,

This is my understanding....

When set to "Level" control, a trigger event is sent whenever the state of the reed change. An "a" indication is sent when the reed closes (shorts the contact with ground) and a "b" indication when it opens.

So when a loco with a magnet crosses a reed switch, the FB module will send an "a" indication as the contact closes and then sends a "b" indication as the contact reopens after the loco has passed.


When set to "Flank" control, a trigger event is sent when the reed closes. The event is an "a" indication.

So when a loco with a magnet crosses the reed switch, the FB module will send an "a" indication only.

 

[Ralphmp]

Thanks guys. This helps a lot.

Best wishes
Phil

 

[Ralphmp]

Need a bit more help on this if anyone has time.

I'm trying to create a simple scenario where if a locomotive approaches a set of points going forwards it switches the points in one direction, but if it approaches in reverse it switches the points in the other direction. So I was hoping to exploit the apparent direction sensitive triggering feature in the Feedback Module. However, despite much umming and ah-hahing I am flummoxed by the following text from the Massoth manual (hope it's OK to share the following extract) -

2.2.3. Direction Sensitive Triggering
The driving direction may be detected if two reed contacts are positioned one after another.
In case “b” is triggered first and thereafter “a”, an “a” is sent for the driving direction.
In case “a” is triggered first and “b” thereafter, a “b” is sent for the opposite driving direction.

Am I making a false assumption that the reed contacts referred to are Massoth Track Contacts when in fact they are something different? If they are the same, can anyone suggest how I should wire them up to achieve direction sensitive triggering? (There is an illustration in the manual - Illustration 1 - showing two track contacts connected to the Feedback Module but there is no indication if this is how one needs to make the connections to achieve direction sensitive triggering.)

Hopefully someone can shed some light on this for me.

Many thanks in advance

Phil

 

[muns]

When they mean "direction" sensing they refer to the direction of travel across the contacts, not the direction of travel of the locomotive.

Say you have two contacts on the track:

==========A==B============

A= Contact connected to the "a" terminal
B = Contact connected to the "b" terminal

Train travels from left to right, triggering the A contact then the B contact. The feedback module will signal the "b" contact trigger.
Train travels from right to left, triggering the B contact then the A contact. The feedback module will signal the "a" contact trigger.

The direction that the locomotive is running (forward/reverse) is irrelevant.

To set up direction sensing you need to set (for contact pair 1) CV55 to 4.

Hope that makes it a bit clearer!

 

[Ralphmp]

Yes it does. Thanks once again for the clarity Mark.

So just to make sure I've got it:

• I need 2 contacts as in your diagram above with the "signal" wires connected to 1a and 1b on the feedback module as you described
• I assume I also need to join the ground wires from the two contacts together and connect them to the GND terminal that accompanies 1a and 1b
• I set CV 55 to 4
• I can then set up the Autoswitch commands in my central station to achieve the necessary point direction change depending on direction of travel

Testing this out will give me something to do over the Easter weekend!

Cheers