LGB points - Hand operated not switching

S

Sarah Winfield

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I seem to recall a similar question but I can't seem to find the answer.

My point will change direction fine one way but the other it needs some help. I have had the cover off and assume it is the spring which is the problem.

Either it is installed incorrectly or, though use, the spring has become slack(!).

Would it be possible please for a member with a similar point to photograph the inside of the switching mechanism so I can compare it with my point?

Thank you in anticipation,

Sarah Winfield
 
No photo , apologies. Im at the office.....

What you describe is common.
Imho, you should not spread the spring for more ooompf in its return. This defeat the easy passing through by rolling stock when moving against the closed rail.
But, some thoughts.
Unless the spring is rusted, it is more likely there is dirt.

I take the spring box apart, wash every surface thoroughly, using dish detergent and a toothbrush, rinse , dry and dust with powdered lube, such as graphite. A scraped pencil lead works every bit as well if you dont have a tube of dry lube. Apply with a small brush or cotton swab.
Repeat with switch itself, under the tap, paying attention to the all moving areas and the bar upon which the points slide. Dry. Lgb recommends a drop of oil on the pivot points. Since your track is indoors this is fine, otherwise, i prefer dry lube as it doesnt attract grit.

You should be able to feel if the switch rails move freely when the spring box is removed, and, the spring box too, once reassembled. Hope you are sucessful.
 
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double , no triple, clicked....ooops
 
Hi Steve. Many thanks for your reply.

I would like a photograph showing the internals of the switch so I can compare it with my point. I can't be sure the spring is located in the right way: not because of anything I have done but the point hasn't operated correctly since I bought it off ebay.

Sarah Winfield
 
Sarah Winfield said:
Hi Steve. Many thanks for your reply.

I would like a photograph showing the internals of the switch so I can compare it with my point. I can't be sure the spring is located in the right way: not because of anything I have done but the point hasn't operated correctly since I bought it off ebay.

Sarah Winfield
Click to expand...


Sarah,


There are two issues here.

1/ Are your point blades free to slide back and forth without resistance? (Most likely cause of your trouble)

2/ Is your spring point mechanism not working (far less likely)

I would suggest that you carefully remove the two screws that hold your point actuator in place and then test the point and actuator seperately.

If there is some resistance on the point blades an important thing is to ensure that the two rubing plates (near the stock rails that the point blades rest on) are clean and bright. I use a fibreglass scratch brush to clean mine. Once the plates are cleaned the point blades need to be worked back and forth a few times by hand, whilst at the same time pushing gently on them directly over the rubbing plate. This will ensure any crud under the blade is removed too, as this is otherwise impossible to get at without dismantling the point! Make sure you blow any debris that is losend out after cleaning

Obviously oiling the pivot points helps too, but it is usually the plates that cause stiffness

The modern one piece blades that pivot near the frog are far heavier than the shorter baldes used on the earlier type points, (assuming you are talking about an R1 point of course), so there is more weight for the spring to shift and more drag if there is any dirt or corrosion.

Finally once removed from the point test the actuator in both directions. It should give an nice satifying clunk as it throws. You can feel the force in the actuator bar against your finger as it goes over. It my experience of using these both inside and outdoors, they rarely go wrong. It is usually the point being stiff that causes a failure.

I will glady post an image of the insides of an actuator if this will help, but I would recommend trying the above before opening the box.

James
 
Are you using these on the points?

http://www.champex-linden.de/lgb_pr...f37a539c1256def005510e202ec.html?OpenDocument

You can remove the screw at the top, remove the cover, and clean out the mechanism.

You can check the blades are not jammed. There is a brass rubbing strip under the blades which can be cleaned and lubricated with copper slip.

Also, turn the point up side down and check the screws on the blade pivots are tightened. This helps electrically as well as mechanically....
 
Hello.

Yes, I have tried the actions suggested and there is some improvement, though still not what I would have expected. Definitely not a "clunk". However I will persevere.

Another question please? The brass rail joiner are quite corroded and I think this is causing poor electrical continuity.
1) Is it easy to replace these joiners please?
2) Can they be dipped in a solution which will clean them up? (I am thinking of the advert where a penny is left in a popular cleaning product and come up shiny and bright)
3) On one of my points the ends of the rails have been drilled and tapped. Is this done to improve conductivity when left outside?

Many thanks,

Sarah
 
Dip the fish plates in sauce. To replace you have to twist them off and it is tricky, but others have mentioned a led destructive method. And you are correct re drilling and tapping....
 
Yes, I am correct. The ends of the rails have been drilled and tapped.
Re the dipping in sauce. Would that be brown or red, please explain?
 
Sarah Winfield said:
Yes, I am correct. The ends of the rails have been drilled and tapped.
Re the dipping in sauce. Would that be brown or red, please explain?
Click to expand...
White vinegar is my preferred method - a mild acid

Others have tried various other flavours, including Coke - on the basis, I assume, that .................. you guessed it............

Things go better with Coca Cola :p:p:p:p
 
Sarah Winfield said:
Hello.

Yes, I have tried the actions suggested and there is some improvement, though still not what I would have expected. Definitely not a "clunk". However I will persevere.

Another question please? The brass rail joiner are quite corroded and I think this is causing poor electrical continuity.
1) Is it easy to replace these joiners please?
2) Can they be dipped in a solution which will clean them up? (I am thinking of the advert where a penny is left in a popular cleaning product and come up shiny and bright)
3) On one of my points the ends of the rails have been drilled and tapped. Is this done to improve conductivity when left outside?

Many thanks,

Sarah
Click to expand...
Fishplates overnight in Coka Cola to return to pristine condition as well.
JonD
 
n general, LGB fishplates are held in place by two methods..... the bottom of the plate is 'anchored' to the rail by a small dimple stamped to hold it to the rail. The railbound end of the fishplate also has a 90° bend in the bottom of it to slot into the sleeper to stop it, and the rail moving. To remove a plate (from plain track, or a turnout if the rail can be slid back) you are supposed to drill out the dimple (thus releasing the grip on the rail), and slide the rail back through the sleeper base. Now moi, being somewhat impatient, and often lacking the proper equipment, have developed a 'shortcut' whereby I grip the fishplate with pliers, and accurately whack the rail in the right direction to send it back out of the fishplate, then just lift it out of the sleeper base. DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME. :confused:
(But it works for me. ) I have yet to figure a way of nondestructive removal of fishplates from the frogs of LGB points . Since I don't have any points set facing frog to frog, this is not a problem, I just insert insulated joints another rail length along.
 
Sarah Winfield said:
3) On one of my points the ends of the rails have been drilled and tapped. Is this done to improve conductivity when left outside?

Many thanks,

Sarah
Click to expand...

Sounds like you may have an Aristocraft turnout. That is normal for theirs. Do the sleepers look skinnier than the LGB ones?
 
Sarah Winfield said:
Yes, I am correct. The ends of the rails have been drilled and tapped.
Re the dipping in sauce. Would that be brown or red, please explain?
Click to expand...
Whichever is your preferred choice! I prefer Ketchup on chips meself, but brown on bangers.

Seriously though, here is the science. Sauces contain vinegar, which is Acetic Acid. It is the acid which dissolves the dirt and tarnish. Vinegar and Cola work well enough, but the advantage of a sauce is that it is thick and gloopy, and it can be spread easily on your fishplates, old pennies, etc ....
 
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H
Gavin Sowry said:
n general, LGB fishplates are held in place by two methods..... the bottom of the plate is 'anchored' to the rail by a small dimple stamped to hold it to the rail. The railbound end of the fishplate also has a 90° bend in the bottom of it to slot into the sleeper to stop it, and the rail moving. To remove a plate (from plain track, or a turnout if the rail can be slid back) you are supposed to drill out the dimple (thus releasing the grip on the rail), and slide the rail back through the sleeper base. Now moi, being somewhat impatient, and often lacking the proper equipment, have developed a 'shortcut' whereby I grip the fishplate with pliers, and accurately whack the rail in the right direction to send it back out of the fishplate, then just lift it out of the sleeper base. DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME. :confused:
(But it works for me. ) I have yet to figure a way of nondestructive removal of fishplates from the frogs of LGB points . Since I don't have any points set facing frog to frog, this is not a problem, I just insert insulated joints another rail length along.
Click to expand...
Hm sometime back there was a post on here linking a Youtube Vid to show LGB Fishplate removal. A quick tube search failed to find it, perhaps someone remembers or has it book marked.

EDIT 2 threads on the go about LGB Fishplate removal. My preferred method is to Hold The Rail Upside down in a Vice as close as possible to the Fishplate. Whack it off using a Flat Punch with a Pin Hammer.

Repeat above for each Fishplate to be removed. Oh a Six Inch Nail with the Point filed or cut off will make a suitable Punch for thus job.

EDIT AGAIN
Forgot I also Hacksaw the Tab off prior to starting.
JonD
 
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I seem to remember in the past I've done a few on points by drilling out the spot-weld dimple and bending over the tang on the underside so the fishplate can slide out. In general I find that time consuming so I just bend them off and discard if not recoverable.
 
Gavin Sowry said:
Sounds like you may have an Aristocraft turnout. That is normal for theirs. Do the sleepers look skinnier than the LGB ones?
Click to expand...

Plus the sleepers will be a different colour. Although I prefer Aristo screw fixed connectors, the LGB ones seem to have better conductivity!
 
trammayo said:
Plus the sleepers will be a different colour. .........
Click to expand...

As will the rail itself be... Aristo brass rail is much "yellower" than most other makes, and (in my experience) does not tarnish as quickly when outdoors, and as you say their plastic sleepers are black rather than the brown of LGB and others.

Jon.
 
I have quite a bit of Aristo, particularly 4ft Rad curves to give a regular reliable curve. A couple of close ups give some brutal but irrelavant truth from normal viewing distance

Below, Aristo to the right with LGB to the left. The Yellow of the Aristo has still not tarnished after approx 3.5 Years outside on my line plus who knows what before as it was a second hand purchase from a member of this forum in Oxfordshire. At close up the Black of the Aristo Sleepers is clearly visible. But again at normal viewing distance hardly noticed. Note that I have replaced differing Fishplates with Clamps my norm (in this case Massoth).
image.jpeg
Below Aristo Left to Peco Right. Similar notes re Rail Colour. But Sleeper Colour though not size is pretty well similar. Though Sleeper Size noticeably different from this view, though again not noticed from normal viewpoint. Track Clamp unknown Converter, probably from Glendale x Ruschbahn.image.jpeg
JonD
 
Thank you for all your replies.

I did try the white vinegar and, although I only experimented with one short piece of track, leaving it overnight the results have been encouraging. I did notice that the fluid has turned the brass a "coppery colour" rather than the "gold colour" of brass.

I'll try dangling just the end of the rail with its fishplate in the vinegar.

What would be the effect if I used a weak solution of soda, please?

I now have enough track for a U shaped layout with passing loop and cross over.

My next purchase should be some stock including a couple of short carriages' and some wagons.

A second small locomotive is also a want.

Sarah
 
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