Help with light and sound options...

[jameshilton]

Hi guys,
As most of you have probably noticed, by big kit from Germany has arrived for the Faur L45H/Lxd2 (http://www.gscalecentral.net/m202013 ).

It is provided with two powered motor bogies. These appear to be custom units using parts from USA trains, and has two trailing leads of fine gauge wire to allow you to wire them together to improve the length of pick ups over the whole diesel. Hence, without stripping down these custom units I guess that means there is no easy provision for DCC.

My basic requirements are simply constant brightness directional lighting.
Is there an easy 'off the shelf' solution to this?

Next I run analog, but want to consider fitting sound.
Is it possible to fit a sound card without spliting these motor units and seperating the pickups from the motor connections? (i.e. just powering the sound chip straight from the track voltage?)
Would a sound card (or chip) have lighting output capability?
I want a diesel hydraulic sound, without all the 'station announcements' and guff you see on the advert or Massoth demo files on their website. How does all that work?
How do you adjust sound volume? Can you do it via a small potentiometer (i.e. without access to a DCC system).
What are my options? Who supplies stuff like this?

I guess the ultimate would be to fit DCC...
I guess a chip with sound built in would then be the best option - and would provide constant 5V output for light sources?
Can these be setup to run on an analog system with sound?

Advice on options would be appreciated

 

[Gizzy]

A Massoth XLS decoder sounds like the kit you need James?

http://www.massoth.com/en/produkte/8210000.en.php

These work on fine analogue layouts, but might need programing by someone with a Sprog or similar....

 

[jameshilton]

Thanks Gizzy - I presume I would have to split the custom built motor bogies to use one of these though?
It does indeed satisfy all the requirements - but I want to also know what the other options are...

1) easy constant brightness lighting (cheap and easy)
2) easy sound without modifying the drive units
3) Combination of 1&2, and modify the drive units = Massoth XLS

 

[Gizzy]

Thanks Gizzy - I presume I would have to split the custom built motor bogies to use one of these though?
It does indeed satisfy all the requirements - but I want to also know what the other options are...

1) easy constant brightness lighting (cheap and easy)
2) easy sound without modifying the drive units
3) Combination of 1&2, and modify the drive units = Massoth XLS

Never installed an XLS, but the XL decoder I fitted to my 2095 class OBB wizzy Bo-Bo had a set of cables for each bogie from memory? I think you just have to cable up each bogie (4 wires, 2 pick up and 2 motor) to the relevant terminals on the chip.

I remember because at first I only wired up one bogie, not realising what the second bogie cable set was for. I had to fit this second cable assy for both bogies to drive....

 

[Phil]

These work on fine analogue layouts, but might need programing by someone with a Sprog or similar....

All Massoth decoders come ready to run on analog layouts or digital, put it on the track.. and off you go..

 

[Gizzy]

These work on fine analogue layouts, but might need programing by someone with a Sprog or similar....

All Massoth decoders come ready to run on analog layouts or digital, put it on the track.. and off you go..

True enough Phil, but as James is adapting a kit, he may need to set up CVs for lighting. He did specify constant 5 Volts and he would need to check the relevant CV setting using a programmer, or he could end up blowing his lamps/LEDs with too high a voltage....

 

[Phil]

These work on fine analogue layouts, but might need programing by someone with a Sprog or similar....

All Massoth decoders come ready to run on analog layouts or digital, put it on the track.. and off you go..

True enough Phil, but as James is adapting a kit, he may need to set up CVs for lighting. He did specify constant 5 Volts and he would need to check the relevant CV setting using a programmer, or he could end up blowing his lamps/LEDs with too high a voltage....

I think the massoth Decoders are set to full track power for the lights..

 

[Gizzy]

These work on fine analogue layouts, but might need programing by someone with a Sprog or similar....

All Massoth decoders come ready to run on analog layouts or digital, put it on the track.. and off you go..

True enough Phil, but as James is adapting a kit, he may need to set up CVs for lighting. He did specify constant 5 Volts and he would need to check the relevant CV setting using a programmer, or he could end up blowing his lamps/LEDs with too high a voltage....

I think the massoth Decoders are set to full track power for the lights..

In that case, James would need to set the CV accordingly.

I believe Massoth supplied the LGB chips and so it should be CV 50 set to 5.

I can do this on my LGB 55045 decoder programmer as shown, but someone local to James (The Stainzmeister?) may be able to do it using a Sprog....

 

[Phil]

Or somebody with a Massoth 1200z?

 

[Gizzy]

Or somebody with a Massoth 1200z?

Of course, but I am not fortunate enough myself to own one as yet.

I've changed CVs on my MTS Remote before, but I now that find the LGB MTS-PC software easier to use, for LGB/Massoth decoders. The GUI as shown above actually highlights in blue text below, that setting CV50 to 5 is the correct setting, for 5 volt lamps.

For other manufacturer's chips that may be mapped differently, I can still set single CV values as required. I recenly had to do so on an MRC decoder....

 

[shropshire lad]

Reading James' original post it sounds like the pickup/motor connections are done internally within the drive so splitting them to fit a decoder would be required ( and quite possibly a PITA) I've chipped a few split chassis locos in OO gauge and they can be a real pain.
Incidently any decent DCC system will program a Massoth decoder

 

[jameshilton]

Reading James' original post it sounds like the pickup/motor connections are done internally within the drive so splitting them to fit a decoder would be required ( and quite possibly a PITA)

That's right Colin
A PITA - and possible damaging to the units that are custom made by the kit manufacturer, hence why I wanted all the options.

 

[Gizzy]

Reading James' original post it sounds like the pickup/motor connections are done internally within the drive so splitting them to fit a decoder would be required ( and quite possibly a PITA) I've chipped a few split chassis locos in OO gauge and they can be a real pain.
Incidently any decent DCC system will program a Massoth decoder

James could still use the track power to make the sound work in the decoder though Colin?

It wouldn't be wired in the conventional DCC manner I agree, but he would have the constant lighting and sound that he desires, by wiring the decoder to the pickups....

 

[shropshire lad]

How about a small scale sound chip connected to the pick up cabling. led lighting would solve the brightness issue and if you ran the lights off the decoder they could be directional quite easily or permanently on if required

 

[shropshire lad]

Absolutely Gizzy but if it wasn't driving the motors you wouldn't need an XLS chip.
Even a cheap CT one would be fine,they control my Stainzs well even with the motor load

 

[jameshilton]

What's the maximum voltage on a small scale one? Ok on conventional old fashioned LGB analog?

 

[Gizzy]

I guess you just wire this smaller decoder just for sound and lights, and not motor power?

Worth a go I guess! Something I hadn't considered at all.

My original thinking with the Massoth XLS chip was to do with the current hungry USAT motor blocks, and the fact James may want to run his loco on a DCC layout at some point? A later upgrade would involve dismantling the loco again, so I was thinking of future proofing....

 

[shropshire lad]

You"d have to check the individual chip James but my CT Elektronik chips run at 22 volts all the time and the Loksound in my Fieldbahn lok is rated up to 35 volts

 

[Zerogee]

James - I think you're right in that the motor blocks look like they are internally connected for analogue operation only, but quite honestly I'm very surprised by this - I would have expected Rene to have made it simple to DCC-chip his kit, and all that would have required is to make the motor blocks 4-wire (2 motor leads, 2 track power) - for analogue operation you'd just connect the paired wires, for DCC you'd wire them to the decoder - as a certain Meerkat would say, "Simples!".
If he hasn't provided this facility - which, as I said, would be a rather odd decision on his part - then you'd have to dismantle the blocks and internally rewire them to allow chipping, if you ever wanted to go DCC.

BUT, leaving that aside, as long as the two extension leads from each block are delivering track power, then you could very easily add a Massoth S sound module - the two wires from the S (brown and white) just connect directly to the track power leads, and it just works, on analogue or on DCC. Even without DCC/MTS control you would get the running sounds and idling/startup sequences, plus a blast from the horn on pull-away and (if you are careful with the controller knob) the brake squeal on slowing down.

Jon.

 

[shropshire lad]

The S module is a great chip Jon but it depends on what James wants. A small sound chip would be just as easy to connect up and make controlling the lights easier as the chip could regulate voltage as well as switch head and tail lights directionally if required. I know you pays your money and takes your choice but you'd save some money too!