Hall Class Custom Build

BakerJohn

BakerJohn

Baker, Modeler, Flour Ambassador
Hello everyone. I am looking at the possibility of kit-bashing a Bachmann 4-6-0 steam locomotive into a GWR 4900 Hall Class locomotive to be painted in Olton Hall's current livery as the Hogwarts Express. However, I have a technical question: If a length of the prototype loco is given as 63ft (19.21m), is that just the engine or the tender as well? If it's both then the Bachmann loco will work well. I will need to find a different tender though.

Thanks!
 
BakerJohn

BakerJohn

Baker, Modeler, Flour Ambassador
Duh, drawings. Why didn't I think of that?! Thanks, Rhino!
 
P

Paul M

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BakerJohn

BakerJohn

Baker, Modeler, Flour Ambassador
So, I've looked through 1:32 scale wheels on Slater's Plastikard's website. They don't have any of the right wheels for the Hall. Does any one have other suggestions?
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
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So, I've looked through 1:32 scale wheels on Slater's Plastikard's website. They don't have any of the right wheels for the Hall. Does any one have other suggestions?
Well, that's a blow :banghead:
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
26,697
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North West Norfolk
So, I've looked through 1:32 scale wheels on Slater's Plastikard's website. They don't have any of the right wheels for the Hall. Does any one have other suggestions?
Aha - try the 10mm section - there are two versions of Gauge 1 - 10mm : 1ft or 1:32 don't even ask why o_Oo_Oo_O
 
BakerJohn

BakerJohn

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Aha - try the 10mm section - there are two versions of Gauge 1 - 10mm : 1ft or 1:32 don't even ask why o_Oo_Oo_O
Well, that was better. But, still didn't quite do it. They have the right categories but not enough dimension choices. 10mm or 1/32 scale work.
Tender Wheels: 4' 6" diameter (outside bearings)​
Driving Wheels: 6' diameter (crank pins & coupling rods)​
Pony Wheels: 3' diameter​
 
T

Timmo

Registered
25 Apr 2016
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6
Bath
Hi John, you could try cast iron wheels from Walsall Model Industries, these are machined to your choice of wheel diameter and standards as shown on the following web pages:

Driving Wheels – 6ft Diameter – 20 Spokes - www.walsallmodelindustries.co.uk/product.php/6_0/?k=:::1115454

Bogie Wheels – 3ft Diameter. – 10 Spokes - www.walsallmodelindustries.co.uk/product.php/3_0/?k=:::1113959

Tender Wheels – 4ft 1.5in – 12 Spokes - www.walsallmodelindustries.co.uk/product.php/4-0_tender_wheel_casting/?k=:::6736620

They also supply axles for inside and outside frames.


Not cheap though!!!

Tim
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
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Aha - try the 10mm section - there are two versions of Gauge 1 - 10mm : 1ft or 1:32 don't even ask why o_Oo_Oo_O
A bit like 7 1/4" over here, and 7 1/2" over there.. :(:rolleyes::giggle::giggle:
 
David1226

David1226

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A bit like 7 1/4" over here, and 7 1/2" over there.. :(:rolleyes::giggle::giggle:
Actually, half the US run 7 1/4" and half 7 1/2" which is why it is so difficult to organise a national event for those gauges in the US.

David
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
26,697
1,074
North West Norfolk
Well, that was better. But, still didn't quite do it. They have the right categories but not enough dimension choices. 10mm or 1/32 scale work.
Tender Wheels: 4' 6" diameter (outside bearings)​
Driving Wheels: 6' diameter (crank pins & coupling rods)​
Pony Wheels: 3' diameter​
Ah, I only looked at the drivers :emo::emo:
 
tac foley

tac foley

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11 Apr 2017
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Well, folks, I've already posted details of cast-iron wheels from Walsall Model Industries, along with possible prices, but like a lot of other things I've posted recently, that has been ignored. See - https://www.gscalecentral.net/threads/sunday-17-february-2019.312600/

However.... 10mm to the foot and 1/32 scale really are different, as you'll quickly see if you put them side by side. A bit like the difference between 1/32 gauge 1 and Aristocraft and USA Trains 1/29th scale. 10mm to the foot is, of course, as near 1/30th scale as makes no real odds.

The difference in the US and Canada lies not with the model engineering scale of 1 1/2" to the foot - 1/8th scale in simple terms, but in the adoption of what was perceived to be the correct scale ratio of track gauge and scale.

7 1/4" track gives a scale of ~1:7.8" - pretty near 1/8th scale and easy to calculate as a result, ignoring the slight difference in true scale appearance. I'll let you figure out the difference for scaling stuff to run on 7 1.2" track.

US/Canadian model engineering scale for locomotives differ substantially from those of the rest of the world, and are aimed at making scaling easier by a simple rationalisation.

Their scales are 1/2", 3/4", 1" and 1.5" to the foot. For example, whereas in UK and most of the rest of the world, we run medium-sized locos on 5" gauge, in North America that is 4 3/4" gauge. I think that most of us here would be capable, with a pal or two, of lifting a 5" gauge Duchess out of a vehicle - about 100 lbs or so, but would rather not try the same deal with a Pennsy K4 at at least half as much again.
 
BakerJohn

BakerJohn

Baker, Modeler, Flour Ambassador
Well, folks, I've already posted details of cast-iron wheels from Walsall Model Industries, along with possible prices, but like a lot of other things I've posted recently, that has been ignored. See - https://www.gscalecentral.net/threads/sunday-17-february-2019.312600/

However.... 10mm to the foot and 1/32 scale really are different, as you'll quickly see if you put them side by side. A bit like the difference between 1/32 gauge 1 and Aristocraft and USA Trains 1/29th scale. 10mm to the foot is, of course, as near 1/30th scale as makes no real odds.

The difference in the US and Canada lies not with the model engineering scale of 1 1/2" to the foot - 1/8th scale in simple terms, but in the adoption of what was perceived to be the correct scale ratio of track gauge and scale.

7 1/4" track gives a scale of ~1:7.8" - pretty near 1/8th scale and easy to calculate as a result, ignoring the slight difference in true scale appearance. I'll let you figure out the difference for scaling stuff to run on 7 1.2" track.

US/Canadian model engineering scale for locomotives differ substantially from those of the rest of the world, and are aimed at making scaling easier by a simple rationalisation.

Their scales are 1/2", 3/4", 1" and 1.5" to the foot. For example, whereas in UK and most of the rest of the world, we run medium-sized locos on 5" gauge, in North America that is 4 3/4" gauge. I think that most of us here would be capable, with a pal or two, of lifting a 5" gauge Duchess out of a vehicle - about 100 lbs or so, but would rather not try the same deal with a Pennsy K4 at at least half as much again.
I'm sorry Tac. I didn't ignore you, actually I did look through your responses. I was hoping for a cheaper option though.

Good to understand a bit more about the gauge difference.
 
tac foley

tac foley

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I'm sorry Tac. I didn't ignore you, actually I did look through your responses. I was hoping for a cheaper option though.

Good to understand a bit more about the gauge difference.
The thing to remember is that Gauge 1 is a 'minority sport', no matter how you cut it, and Gauge 1 British outline is VERY small cheese compared with all the German stuff out there. They have people like Kiss mass-producing the stuff over in China - of astounding quality and associated cost. Although we have a good many manufacturers here in UK where Gauge 1 is concerned, there is nobody turning out the 500 at a time Swiss locos and others like the Germans/Chinese. Other German companies, like Bockholt, make G1 models of astounding complexity - electrically-powered - that actually cost more than the average family sedan. They sell them as fast as they make them, too.
 
BakerJohn

BakerJohn

Baker, Modeler, Flour Ambassador
I am reviving this thread out of pure boredom. I know I shouldn't be buying any parts for a new project (especially since I have no railroad to run anything on). But, I have spent a few hours looking at this project now.
So, to refresh. I am looking to custom build a 1:32 Hall class locomotive. Wheels are mostly figured out, and I spent today scaling a drawing I found to 1:32.
Hall Drawing_scaled.png

I think that I can kitbash this from a Bachmann 4-6-0 such as this one: <Bachmann 4-6-0 Big Hauler "7" Steam Locomotive - Need Tender | eBay> . Severe modifications would have to be made including the larger drivers, shorter cab, and the rectangular section front of the cab (not sure if that has a different name). Plus it would need a tender. I'm quite sure that I could fit batteries, boards, and a speaker in the smokebox and boiler.

In terms of the wheels, Tim's suggestion is probably my best bet. The tender wheels are off by 10%, which is not great. But, I can figure that out down the line.
Any other thoughts, suggestions, or concerns are appreciated. I may cave and buy that cheap bachmann loco... :/
 
musket the dog

musket the dog

Professional engineer, amateur modeler
31 Oct 2009
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Leicester
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What about the drivers from Piko's BR64? Piko seem to have a pretty good supply of spares. According to this thread they are 58mm in diameter. If we're talking about a 6ft wheel at 1:32 I think that would make them around 1mm over size. I imagine it would also be significantly less expensive than the full set from Walsall.

One thing I might be wary of if you go down the route of having gauge 1 wheels machined specifically is that they might not mix too well with g scale track. Even though the gauge is the same, the tyre widths and flange depths will all be quite different. It might also be worth having a check around too and seeing if you can find any examples of people using different wheels in the Bachmann chassis.

In case you were still wondering, the square section in front of the cab is the firebox :)
 
tac foley

tac foley

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BakerJohn - remember that British Gauge 1 is actually morel likely to be 10mm to the foot - a far more common scale these days. As such, you'd would have to decide whether to go along with a kit-built tender from one of our G1 suppliers - THAT would have the right wheels but would not be cheap. In fact, by the time you've bought all the parts needed to scratch-build a suitable tender, that may well be the best plan. Barrett engineering make such a kit for £372 - Tenders - GWR 4000G is the one for your loco - in 10mm to the foot scale. Images from Barrett Live Steam Services website.

1585068013499.png


PS - as it was the British who invented the steam locomotive, the vast majority of descriptive terms applied to them have been used by English-speakers to THEIR steam locomotives, too.
 
Last edited:
The mechanic

The mechanic

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24 Nov 2016
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9
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Black Country
I am reviving this thread out of pure boredom. I know I shouldn't be buying any parts for a new project (especially since I have no railroad to run anything on). But, I have spent a few hours looking at this project now.
So, to refresh. I am looking to custom build a 1:32 Hall class locomotive. Wheels are mostly figured out, and I spent today scaling a drawing I found to 1:32. View attachment 263127
I think that I can kitbash this from a Bachmann 4-6-0 such as this one: <Bachmann 4-6-0 Big Hauler "7" Steam Locomotive - Need Tender | eBay> . Severe modifications would have to be made including the larger drivers, shorter cab, and the rectangular section front of the cab (not sure if that has a different name). Plus it would need a tender. I'm quite sure that I could fit batteries, boards, and a speaker in the smokebox and boiler.

In terms of the wheels, Tim's suggestion is probably my best bet. The tender wheels are off by 10%, which is not great. But, I can figure that out down the line.


Any other thoughts, suggestions, or concerns are appreciated. I may cave and buy that cheap bachmann loco... :/
If you are struggling with driving wheel size, why don't you build GWR 68xx Grange class instead? - near identical boiler, superstructure and wheelbase - just smaller wheels!