Frustrating Decal application problem

[Tim Brien]

I have been applying decals for over fifty years and have decalled several hundred models in that time. My preferred method has always been one drop of detergent in the water used to soften the decal backing. The decal is then transferred to tissue for a few seconds for excess water to drain. Decal settling solution (always has been Micro-Sol) is then applied to the surface the decal is to be applied to. surface is always gloss painted for better adhesion and to disguise the clear film backing. Decal is slid off the backing and settled in position.

Now the frustration. I am still using the same decal manufacturer, the same paint supplier and the same decal settling solution. My problem is that the decal adheres to the surface immediately with no facility for slippage to slide into position. Precise decal placement is nigh well impossible. I spoke to the decal manufacturer and he advises copious amounts of detergent in the 'soaking' water, plus using the same water on the painted surface (not decal settling solution). In fact the manufacturer does not ever use decal settling solution.

I tried this method, even to the point of rubbing the detergent laden water into the painted surface to try to break surface tension. It is very hit or miss. I may try rubbing straight detergent on the surface. There is simply too much grip from the paint.

 

[maxi-model]

I've never come across that. Sounds like you need a wetting agent. I always use micro set (sometimes diluted as some decal types can curl excessivly with it ) first brushed on the paintwork to allow movement of the decal and help hide the carrier film. Without it most decals will fix in place too quickly. If the decal start setting before it is correctly positioned then I brush in some more under the decal.
I then use micro sol, or even stronger decal softening agents, brushed on to the decal to help it conform to the surface. I have spent the last 25 years doing that on mainly 1/43 scale modeel race cars, lots of compound curves to get decals to conform to there and a need to keep them wet and workable on the surface !
Paint sould not be the ploblem as that is a non permeable surface that should be smooth. If it is an automotive "rattle can" type acrylic finish you are using you could try a little "T-Cut" to make it a little slicker. Mind you that might make the decal stick a little quicker as and air and water behind the decal will clear even quicker.
Max.

 

[Tim Brien]

Today I used plenty of detergent, more than I am comfortable with using. I had a measure of success with most behaving, but due the amount of detergent it was like watching paint dry awaiting the decals to stick without moving when cleaning the residue. It took hours. The manufacturer recommends awaiting 24 hours prior overcoating.

The current problem may relate to the extremely smooth surface that I am applying to. I used #800 grit paper to sand the finish mirror smooth and applying the finish coat. This may prevent the decal from moving.

 

[jameshilton]

Micro-sol is a decal softening solution. When applying over a high gloss paintwork I'd imagine it might make the transfer stick solid (dependant onthe backing material thickness - which might be the variable that has changed). Perhaps try Micro-set, which is more a wetting solution. I've never needed to use detergent in the water - but I don't apply large transfers as a rule.

 

[beavercreek]

I swear by Fairy meself........
And same method as Max. I use Microset and Microsol.
Also agree with Ross about the paper.
I have found it a bit more difficult tracking down the thinner version of the white laser decal paper recently. It is the only way to get white text or content using laser.

Does any one know anyone who does decal printing using an ALPS printer where you can get white on clear. If you do, do they take the digital artwork that you make and just do a turn around print?

 

[Neil Robinson]

Does any one know anyone who does decal printing using an ALPS printer where you can get white on clear. If you do, do they take the digital artwork that you make and just do a turn around print?

Try Chris Moxham.
http://www.cbtransfers.co.uk/railwa...slide transfers for me a couple of years ago.

 

[jameshilton]

Does any one know anyone who does decal printing using an ALPS printer where you can get white on clear. If you do, do they take the digital artwork that you make and just do a turn around print?

I always use Precision Labels (www.precisionlabels.com) - great service and reasonable prices. He can do multi-coloured artwork for you too... I always do my own artwork but he will draw it up for you as well for a price.

 

[ntpntpntp]

A further vote for using Micro-Set as the potion to place decals and Micro-Sol only when you need to really soften the decal and draw it onto uneven surfaces. Micro-Sol is more agressive on the decal film, so if you've got a new batch of decal paper with slightly different formulation this may be why the latest decals are sticking immediately if you're using Micro-Sol.

 

[beavercreek]

Does any one know anyone who does decal printing using an ALPS printer where you can get white on clear. If you do, do they take the digital artwork that you make and just do a turn around print?

I always use Precision Labels (www.precisionlabels.com) - great service and reasonable prices. He can do multi-coloured artwork for you too... I always do my own artwork but he will draw it up for you as well for a price.

Yeah James, I also do all my own artwork, even 'pre-weathering' decals in the artwork to match the loco or rolling stock that they are going onto. Most of the time I can get away with white lettering on black backgound (sometimes a shade of black or weathered black to match the loco) Or I try a matching colour background shade if appying to a piece of rolling stock then weather it in.
But there are times when only white (or very light colour) on clear will do and this is the need for an ALPS printer (OKI or citizen did clones of these).