DCC issue with isolation sections

[mikeked]

Can someone help, I'm using LGB central station mk. 2 with parrarel fuction to operate LGB control boxes for points, isolation track and lighting,
but when send engines through the isolation track in reverse the speed control does not operate and they go through at high speed, forward motion is controlable.
I run DCC and analogue engines. At the moment i am looking for a 52750 LGB booster box to boost the control boxes.
I'm very reluctant to change to a newer system as track pick up as not been a problem and i like to run engines unattended.
I run LGB ,Aritstocraft, gauge one and 16mm live steam adjusted to 45mm track the last two options i attend to.,All my track is LGB g gauge.
As LGB do not sell this central station now are there ways of supplementing this system with out great expense.

 

[muns]

Can someone help, I'm using LGB central station mk. 2 with parrarel fuction to operate LGB control boxes for points, isolation track and lighting,
but when send engines through the isolation track in reverse the speed control does not operate and they go through at high speed, forward motion is controlable.
I run DCC and analogue engines. At the moment i am looking for a 52750 LGB booster box to boost the control boxes.
I'm very reluctant to change to a newer system as track pick up as not been a problem and i like to run engines unattended.
I run LGB ,Aritstocraft, gauge one and 16mm live steam adjusted to 45mm track the last two options i attend to.,All my track is LGB g gauge.
As LGB do not sell this central station now are there ways of supplementing this system with out great expense.

Please explain what you mean by isolation track?

 

[Greg Elmassian]

I guess wangrudd got as many responses as he could... so new topic...

I would guess "isolation track" = "programming track"

Greg

 

[dunnyrail]

Big assumptions here but I think he means the Isolated bit of the return loop where the LGB Box auto reverses polarity. If so it sounds like the Reverce Loop Module May be faulty?

To properly assist some LGB Numbers of Parts and more information would be helpful.

 

[mikeked]

Thanks for your help on this, part no. are as follows:
central statin 550050 with p sticker on the base, transformer 50110 ac wires to control boxes.
control boxes are 51750 with flip switches for pionts
and 51800 with on off switches to cut off power from isolated sections of track
I have hand held 55016 with p stickers on the base for engine control.
All is L.G.B.
As i have 4 control boxes i'm looking for a 52750 booster to help power these
Would a 550090 central statin booster box be more useful.
I"m reluctant to change this systems because of the extra cost .but i'm more than willing to your suggestions

 

[muns]

Ok, with DCC isolated sections (i.e. ones that can be switched off) are not needed as DCC keeps power to the track at all times and it is the decoder in the locomotive that decodes a signal from the central station to tell it to stop and go. Leave the isolated sections powered.

Have you got any section breaks that have diodes? Maybe you had a automatic reversing unit at one time? If so then these will block the dcc signal and can cause weird stuff to happen.


(I'm going to break this into a new topic if I can work out how and come up with a new title)

 

[Zerogee]

Mike, you mention in your original post that you run both DCC and analogue locos - do you operate your analogue locos under "address 0" with your DCC controller, or do you sometimes switch your system over to a purely analogue controller when you want to run your analogue locos?

I think we are all a little bit confused as to exactly what your question means? As Mark says above, isolated sections are not needed under DCC operation (even if you're using the Address 0 function to run a single analogue loco), but if you do sometimes run your layout under analogue control then I can understand why you still have the isolated sections.

If you can explain a little more, then I'm sure that between everyone on here we can probably help you!

Jon.

 

[wandgrudd]

I guess wangrudd got as many responses as he could... so new topic...

I would guess "isolation track" = "programming track"

Greg

Nothing to do with me.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Right, I was stating that it appears you are not going to get any further responses to your original post, and I hope you got your question answered.

Greg

 

[Zerogee]

Right, I was stating that it appears you are not going to get any further responses to your original post, and I hope you got your question answered.

Greg

Sorry, you've lost me on this one Greg - what original post are you referring to, presumably one in another thread entirely?

Jon.

 

[muns]

Jon, I split this from wandgrudd 's thread What DDC control system is everyone using, views required? - G Scale Central

 

[Zerogee]

Jon, I split this from wangrudd's thread What DDC control system is everyone using, views required? - G Scale Central

Ahh, OK - thanks Muns, that makes sense now - I hadn't realised (or had forgotten..... who am I again...?) that this wasn't an all-new thread started by Mikeked's post.
OK Greg, your post now makes much more sense in context!

So we're now working on how to solve Mikeked's problem, if we can get some more details to help us all understand exactly what is going on.....?

Jon.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

ROGER!! Thanks Jon and Mark.... I was beginning to see double!

I agree, sure sound like diodes unless we are also talking address 0 stuff...

Will be interested to see the answers from the OP

Greg

 

[mikeked]

I'm sorry i've confused you on this question through my own ignorance. The purpose of the isolated track was to be able to park up engines and continue to run others,I do run dcc engines through mts central station and can park them by changing code numbers, and run one analogue engine through the "0" code.
but to make life difficult i also wish to run more analogue engines at the same time hence the isolated track sections. I now know that through the information
you have given me this maybe a problem. i do run dcc and analogue engines at the same time through a gaugemaster 5amp. control and by parking up engines on the isolated track untalising l.g.b. control boxes (527050). i do wish to run analogue and dcc at the same time i'm reluctant to invest in new decoders and control systems
but with demise of L.G.B. control systems this maybe the only solution unless someone has a cleaver solution to running both analogue and dcc engines. Is this really the death of analogue.

 

[PhilP]

Makes more sense now..

If you use an analogue controller, ALL the DCC equipped loco's (and analogue) will run, unless parked on isolated sections.

But, you are asking about engines 'running away' in an isolated section?

Can someone help, I'm using LGB central station mk. 2 with parrarel fuction to operate LGB control boxes for points, isolation track and lighting,
but when send engines through the isolation track in reverse the speed control does not operate and they go through at high speed, forward motion is controlable.

This sounds very much like you have a DCC equipped loco, with a power-buffer in it?
It is recommended that if you have a power-buffer, you turn OFF analogue support. - So the loco would not run on DC power / track.

What tends to happen, is the loco (on power-loss: entering the isolated section, or the power being turned-off once in the section) will suddenly run at 'full-speed' until the buffer is drained.
You sometimes see this on a DCC layout when the 'All Stop' red button is used.

To see if this is the problem:
Run the loco concerned, on the DCC powered track for a minute of two. - This will charge the buffer.
Stop the loco.
Press the red 'Stop' button on your controller (be ready to catch the loco, if necessary). - If the loco moves off, that is the problem.

Give this a go, and let us know the results?

PhilP.

 

[ntpntpntp]

Personally I think you'd be better off fitting decoders to your DC locos and forget trying to mix the two technologies. Although with some DCC systems you can run a non-decoder fitted loco, it works by "bending" the DCC signal in the track. It's really not good for the motor in the long term as you have current flowing through the motor coils even when the loco is stationary - you can hear the DCC signal as a buzz or "singing" in the motor. It's something which has long fallen out of favour in the smaller scales (some small motors can be "fried" quite rapidly") and indeed some DCC systems don't offer that support at all.

Massoth decoders would be an obvious choice for LGB locos, they're cheaper than the near identical LGB decoders (which were also made by Massoth in later years). For really old locos that don't have decoder sockets or pins, hard-wiring is required but not impossible.