What slope can I use ?

Shunter46

Registered
3 Apr 2019
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During the summer I have been building my G gauge garden railway. My track is raised 24 inches off the ground. I have now acquired an “engine” shed that I want run my loco,s into at the end of the day. I need the benches in the shed to have a comfortable working hight, higher than 24 inches . What is considered to be the maximum or usable angle / slope for the track that I can use to give me a comfortable working hight for the Engine shed bench’s ?
 

idlemarvel

Neither idle nor a marvel
13 Jul 2015
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Ascot
You won't be surprised to hear "that depends". It depends on what length of trains you run, whether you are track power or battery, whether the track from your existing railway to the shed can be in a straight line or on a curve etc. But as a ballpark 1:40 is probably okay, 1:20 probably not okay. Anything in between depends on the above.
 

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
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Tamworth, Staffs.
Run the loco's in on the level.. - You can use the under-bench area as stabling for stock etc.

Then have your bench-top, at a convenient height for working.. - You should not need to work on things too much, so can arrange a 'cassette' you can drive a loco on/in to and then transfer it to bench-height.

If you are live-steam, you should be disposing of the fire outside anyway. - You may want to dig a pit to stand in, to make this easier?

Just my ideas.. :)

PhilP.
 

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
28,770
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North West Norfolk
Yebbut, the raised track is only 24 inches - now, was it Monty Python who dug a trench .................. filming on the beach springs to mind.

So just dig a trench in the middle of the shed, and keep the track at 24 inches.

Rhino's really good idea for the day :angel::angel::angel::angel:
 

JimmyB

Semi-Retired; more time for trains.
I have gradients on my railway and posted on this before. 1:25 and most loco's without traction tyres will slip with 3 short carriages, so dependant on what you are running keep less than 1:25, and I would recommend 1:50 if you can manage that.
 
Take a plank of wood and place some track on it.

Run the train on the level plank. Then lift one end and try again.

Keep lifting the one end till the train will not start on the plank. Drop the plank down slightly and you then know what the maximum incline the train will run up.

You need to do this with the trains you intend to run up the incline. You can then make your incline so that all your trains can go up it.
 
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Gavin Sowry

Garden Railroader and Raconteur
27 Oct 2009
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Funny that this question should arise today.... at work, I was asked, in a professional capacity, if our Plasser Track Recording car could make it up a 1 in 28 grade.
For the curious of you, the answer was 'yes'. When we first got the car, we still had a 1 in 25 grade on a branchline (which previously had Fell centre rail braking).
 

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
28,770
3,459
North West Norfolk
One picture that I've never managed to find, is the shunting neck to the old coal yard at Kingston-upon-Thames station - the gradient, I believe was 1 in 30, and I could just see it from one or two of the upstairs classrooms at grammar school :emo: :emo:
 

beavercreek

Travel, Art, Theatre, Music, Photography, Trains
24 Oct 2009
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I have a max gradient of 1:10 (I have managed to bring it down to 1:12 but still steep!) and need to have 'invisibly' motorised rolling stock to 'help' single locos (especially rod steamers) pull a 'decent' length train.
I usually also multi-head locos for more oomph
Geared locos like shays, climaxes and heislers just lap it up with out the motorised rolling stock. But if a really heavy train is in action I will multi-head them as well.

All my diesels have traction tyres and they either are multi-headed or use the motorised rolling stock.

The motorised rolling stock have 'invisible' (from outside) motors in place of the passive bogies.
Aristocrafts centre cab motor bogies are a great fit for US frieght car bogies and USA Trains '44 tonner' motor are just right for passenger car bogies.
They would also be fine for some European outline rolling stock

A couple of 'single' loco trains climbing the heavy incline (with the 'invisible' helper rolling stock)

1 GP9 arbour long.jpg

2 RS3 freight long thin climb.jpg

The telegraph pole behind the train is fully perpendicular

3 RS3 slop close.jpg

The two stock cars at the rear have the motors

4 rs3 climb rear section.jpg

Sometimes it is just fun to multi head locos..here two live-steam shays take up the strain of a complete heavy logging train

5 shay double header long view.jpg
 
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palstig

Registered
12 Sep 2016
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Rushden
Run the loco's in on the level.. - You can use the under-bench area as stabling for stock etc.

Then have your bench-top, at a convenient height for working.. - You should not need to work on things too much, so can arrange a 'cassette' you can drive a loco on/in to and then transfer it to bench-height.

If you are live-steam, you should be disposing of the fire outside anyway. - You may want to dig a pit to stand in, to make this easier?

Just my ideas.. :)

PhilP.
I like that idea. I couldn't help thinking "Anderton Boat Lift".

Paul
 

The Devonian

Registered
17 Nov 2009
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South Hams
During the summer I have been building my G gauge garden railway. My track is raised 24 inches off the ground. I have now acquired an “engine” shed that I want run my loco,s into at the end of the day. I need the benches in the shed to have a comfortable working hight, higher than 24 inches . What is considered to be the maximum or usable angle / slope for the track that I can use to give me a comfortable working hight for the Engine shed bench’s ?
Can you not remove the loco and stock from the track and as a previous post suggests place it beneath your work bench. Or is there a good reason such as arthritis of another issue you have?
Of interest I have had a grade/slope either side of a tree since I built my line in 2005: it is single track but approached with a c I was always unhappy about it.
I did not run long trains - no more than eight cars (mainly Aristocraft) - but it meant that in one direction by a curve - two minus points! In one direction of travel the train would gather speed down the slope. I understood, at an early date, that this was not ideal for the locomotives mechanisms. Consequently the trains always ran in one travel direction only.
This summer - thanks to lockdown - I lifted the tracks either side of the tree - a distance of around 30ft. approximately. I commenced levelling the track - the maximum depth removed by the tree was about three inches. I took the opportunity to rebuild the whole stretch. The trains now are able to run in both directions and with additional cars.

So, my advice is avoid slopes if you can. Your line and its stock will probably increase so plan ahead.
 

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
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Gradients are considered bad by some though I personally see no issues with them. S suggested this only to be for an Engine Shed, that being the case 1:20 would be quite acceptable. To get this gradient get hold of an exact 1” piece of wood and support it under a plank using a ruler to measure your 20 inches or even mark up your 20 inches with a felt tip pen or even a pencil. At this rate you will take 12 of those 20 inches to raise that 12 inches to your comfortable height. Do you have that amount of space?
 

Shunter46

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Gradients are considered bad by some though I personally see no issues with them. S suggested this only to be for an Engine Shed, that being the case 1:20 would be quite acceptable. To get this gradient get hold of an exact 1” piece of wood and support it under a plank using a ruler to measure your 20 inches or even mark up your 20 inches with a felt tip pen or even a pencil. At this rate you will take 12 of those 20 inches to raise that 12 inches to your comfortable height. Do you have that amount of space?
Thanks dunnyrail. I have a straight run up to the shed of just over 13 feet. (165inch) Measuring up today using the advice given so far it looks like 1-20 will give me a reasonable bench hight inside the shed. As soon as the rain stops I will do a trial and test it out.
 

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
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Hm I calculate that to be an 8.25 Inch rise. If you wanted to use under the bench for storage or running trains then you may need to drop some as well.

That gap with track depth will barely give to 8 inches gap, quite tight for G and no space for bench support. Trust me when I say that having somewhere inside a shed to store stock is a number one asset. If that loco shed on the top is just for locomotives you could probably get away with a steeper gradient, same rules about measuring. But do not go beyond 1 inch rise in 15 as the locomotives would certainly struggle to get up steeper on their own, though some on here have used tougher task for their locomotives even with trains but it does take its toll on gears etc.
 

Shunter46

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West Midlands United Kingdom
Hm I calculate that to be an 8.25 Inch rise. If you wanted to use under the bench for storage or running trains then you may need to drop some as well.

That gap with track depth will barely give to 8 inches gap, quite tight for G and no space for bench support. Trust me when I say that having somewhere inside a shed to store stock is a number one asset. If that loco shed on the top is just for locomotives you could probably get away with a steeper gradient, same rules about measuring. But do not go beyond 1 inch rise in 15 as the locomotives would certainly struggle to get up steeper on their own, though some on here have used tougher task for their locomotives even with trains but it does take its toll on gears etc.
Hi Dunnyrail thanks for your input. The Track in the garden is at 22inch high. If I use 1-20 over that 13ft, you are correct this will give me 8.25 inch rise. Added to the 22 inch + 8.25 inch minus the shed floor I3 inch) I make that a bench hight of 27.5 inches. If I then add the depth of track and rails it’s aprx 28 inches hight.
 

Paul M

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25 Oct 2016
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Royston
Gradients are considered bad by some though I personally see no issues with them. S suggested this only to be for an Engine Shed, that being the case 1:20 would be quite acceptable. To get this gradient get hold of an exact 1” piece of wood and support it under a plank using a ruler to measure your 20 inches or even mark up your 20 inches with a felt tip pen or even a pencil. At this rate you will take 12 of those 20 inches to raise that 12 inches to your comfortable height. Do you have that amount of space?
I'm with you there Jon. Obviously you have to be careful, but an incline or 2 does make for more interesting running