track setting indicators

[chris m01]

I often have difficulty remembering which way points are set and following recent changes I now have the ability to isolate the tracks in each passing loop/station. It was clear that I needed some sort of indication system.

My Aristo Train Engineer is used to control track power voltage, eight points and two section switches. The section switches use the normal switch (point motor) accessory unit. One is coupled to an old point motor with switch mechanism and the other to a latching relay set up. My points have LGB motors with the (power) switch accessory added.

The track layout is roughly as shown here

 

[chris m01]

Just above the storage sidings I now have these lights. I'll tidy the wiring tomorrow!
A light on indicates the point is set to that track. If the points on the main circle are not set to the yard then no lights come on.
Both points set to continuous circle - no lights on

Points set to far left storage road, point on main line in other direction still set to circle.

Points now set to middle storage road of the left three and left hand storage road of the right hand pair.

 

[chris m01]

There are two problems with the above - apart from me not putting htem on straight.
Firstly the automotive bulbs take quite a current and secondly the units cost about £3 each. I might change the bulbd to LEDs at £2.95 a pair on Ebay.

So for the others I found a different source. I got three cycle rear lights from the pound shop - yes for £3. As bought they are not much use so I unsoldered the bulbs and mounted them on a piece of circuit board. I have mounted these on the shed so I can see how the lines are set.

Points set to RH line and live at Rosebush, point set to Lakeside, points set to LH line and live at Lavender Hill

RH line live at both Rosebush and Lavender Hill, point set to main line not Lakeside

Power switched off for both Rosebush and Lavender Hill. points set to main line at Lakeside

Points set to RH line and live at Rosebush, point set to Lakeside, and power off at Lavender Hill.

 

[dunnyrail]

Not quite sure how you are getting to this complex set up. Working on the Railways for 29 years tought me that the best way is to follow the prototype. What they do is to have a Main Route through all points this is called the Normal Position. When the point is changed it is Reverce Position. Thus with your line you would decide the Normal for all your points and then the lights would come on only when you have Reverced them.

I use Dell Air/Easy Air on my line and all the points follow this with the Air Operated Points and Signals having the Normal Position as at rest I.e. No air to them. the Air puts them to reverse so that you can see from the numbered levers which Points/Signals have been Reverced. I find that this is more than adequate for me and follows the prototype as closely as it is possible to do.
JonD

 

[chris m01]

And all controlled by the good old Aristo TE. Its great to find what can be aqchieved with these and quite a few metres of wire.

 

[chris m01]

Must confess I have made no attempt to follow prototype practice - just concetrated on what I needed. As I want to know whether power is on or off as well what track is selected I need a light for each track. And anyway I haven't decided which way is normal yet

 

[Dtsteam]

Looks pretty nifty to me, Chris. Is all this worked off the auxiliary switches rather than the TE ? or am I missing a trick. Now all you have to do is remember where the trains are

 

[chris m01]

The TE powers the point motors and the auxilliary switches (which are attached to the points) set the indicator lights and power feed to the track.

I can generally see where the trains are (they do disappear at some points) but I can't see which way the points are set because some or all of them will be a fair way from where I am standing while operating.

 

[Gizzy]

I have LGB point and motors, 4 pairs of crossovers, which have recently been configured to MTS by means of a points decoder.

Some of the points have the route indicator accesory fitted to them as shown below.

These help me see at a glance if the crossover is set. From the side I see a red disc, although the train crew would see a green vertical line. If the points are set to diverge, I then see the green line and the train crew see a yellow arrow indicating the route set. (I've painted the 'insert' in the indicator to give the red, yellow and green 'aspects'; it is usually white.)

I have a couple of 'Type 2' switches on some of the motors, for future signalling. However, I've found that the LGB motors do not have enough 'oomph' to operate the points, a switch and a route indicator together, so I have to be selective in how I mount these on each crossover....

 

[bobg]

You've got me slightly worried now GIzzy, I had planned to operate two Peco points (cross-over) with one LGB motor, I thought they seemed to have plenty of power. I run mine from the DC side of an LGB 5003 controller, so I suppose I could up the voltage a bit if required. Am I likely to have bother?

 

[Gizzy]

You've got me slightly worried now GIzzy, I had planned to operate two Peco points (cross-over) with one LGB motor, I thought they seemed to have plenty of power. I run mine from the DC side of an LGB 5003 controller, so I suppose I could up the voltage a bit if required. Am I likely to have bother?

I'd be interested to see how you operate both points with the one motor Bob?

I should have said that each decoder output operates 2 points motors for the pair of points in the crossover configuration. Each motor can have either the type 2 switch or a indicator added to it, but it seems not both.

I don't think it's due to the electrical nature of the point motor, but more mechanical. I believe that there is not enough torque in the motor to move the blades, the cam for the indcator and the type 2 switch all together.

I reckon you may need 2 motors wired together for the Peco points, but it just might work with just the one and is certainly worth trying....

 

[bobg]

I was going for the same sort of deviice I used for my return loop entry, a simple push pull mechanical linkage. This one is powered by a passing train with one point spring returned.

The bell cranks and screwed links are model aircraft OTS parts. The rod is 1/16" brazing wire, threaded for the links (allows for adjustment). I'm reasonably hopeful.

 

[chris m01]

Thats a well engineered linkage but I reckon 2 motors might be better. If you keep the springs on the Peco points it may prove to be too much for one motor. If you don't keep the spring the blades might not close properly.

 

[bobg]

Thats a well engineered linkage but I reckon 2 motors might be better. If you keep the springs on the Peco points it may prove to be too much for one motor. If you don't keep the spring the blades might not close properly.

Some assistance should be gained from the new linkage being quite short (compared to that above). There are of course some frictional increases. I did not intend to remove the centreing springs.

Being a confirmed, dyed in the wool T/A, I was hoping to save on the cost of one motor.

 

[muns]

You've got me slightly worried now GIzzy, I had planned to operate two Peco points (cross-over) with one LGB motor, I thought they seemed to have plenty of power. I run mine from the DC side of an LGB 5003 controller, so I suppose I could up the voltage a bit if required. Am I likely to have bother?

I'd be interested to see how you operate both points with the one motor Bob?

I should have said that each decoder output operates 2 points motors for the pair of points in the crossover configuration. Each motor can have either the type 2 switch or a indicator added to it, but it seems not both.

I don't think it's due to the electrical nature of the point motor, but more mechanical. I believe that there is not enough torque in the motor to move the blades, the cam for the indcator and the type 2 switch all together.

I reckon you may need 2 motors wired together for the Peco points, but it just might work with just the one and is ceratinly worth trying....

Gary,

You can increase the duration of the switching pulse from the switch decoder which may then provide the umph needed for both the suplementary switch and the route indicator. Increasing this period is also recommended if you are attempting to drive more than one switch motor from a single output.

 

[Gizzy]

Gary,

You can increase the duration of the switching pulse from the switch decoder which may then provide the umph needed for both the suplementary switch and the route indicator. Increasing this period is also recommended if you are attempting to drive more than one switch motor from a single output.

That's interesting Mark? I guess it's a CV setting!
I got the decoder from Bigjack, so I don't have any instructions for it. The adresses I found out by trail and error are 5-6-7-8, which was fine for me as they happen to be the 5th-6th-7th and 8th set of points along the line!

Can you enlighen me on which CV I need to change please?

Ta....

 

[bobg]

You've got me slightly worried now GIzzy, I had planned to operate two Peco points (cross-over) with one LGB motor, I thought they seemed to have plenty of power. I run mine from the DC side of an LGB 5003 controller, so I suppose I could up the voltage a bit if required. Am I likely to have bother?

I'd be interested to see how you operate both points with the one motor Bob?

I should have said that each decoder output operates 2 points motors for the pair of points in the crossover configuration. Each motor can have either the type 2 switch or a indicator added to it, but it seems not both.

I don't think it's due to the electrical nature of the point motor, but more mechanical. I believe that there is not enough torque in the motor to move the blades, the cam for the indcator and the type 2 switch all together.

I reckon you may need 2 motors wired together for the Peco points, but it just might work with just the one and is ceratinly worth trying....

Gary,

You can increase the duration of the switching pulse from the switch decoder which may then provide the umph needed for both the suplementary switch and the route indicator. Increasing this period is also recommended if you are attempting to drive more than one switch motor from a single output.

Ahhh! That may be the answer. Mine are manually switched (from the s/box), so tend to be held till the movement is complete. The cross-over currently has two motors on one switch, and they do not always switch absolutely identically, one (or the other) will sometimes lag a milli-second or two behind. The next major [strike]headache[/strike] task may be to fit signalling and track sensing, at least to the Terminus, though running sections could be fun stuff.