Tell me it's not true, Deltang!

chris m01

chris m01

Registered
24 Oct 2009
4,462
Birmingham, UK
Chris is using a Deltang Rx102, connected to a mTronics Viper speed controller for 'trackside' RC, or switched to the trusty Revolution Train Engineer.

PhilP.
I’m glad somebody knows what I’m doing! I wasn’t at home and am not good at remembering numbers.
The Viper is PWM but at a lower frequency than the deltang controllers. It is fine with Aristo and USA Trains but I haven’t tried it with LGB locos because I don’t own any.
 
ge_rik

ge_rik

British narrow gauge (esp. Southwold and W&LLR)
I think we have miss-understood each other a little, I have a Selecta with 12 options and thus far have used 5. I just went out and tested out the swopping between different Locomotives using my Selecta with 2 locs having Rx65 and 1 having Rx22. With fast swop-over there appeared to be some slight confusion in the Rx still being {Linked} to say 1 when I had changed to 2 on the selecta. However giving a short break between changing commands appeared to be the thing when swopping loco via the selecta, not a problem once you understand. Perhaps I will count to 5 each time. I wonder if Rik had encountered this issue?
Hi Jon
The default 'fumble' time when switching from one Selecta position to the next is 1 sec, but it can take 3 sec for the second loco to respond if there is a speed change. The length of fumble time can be changed by reprogramming the RX.

As Phil says, it's a good idea to switch to a completely different (unused) Selecta channel in between changing from one to another. You can the change the speed setting for the second loco without mucking up either loco's settings. This is particularly useful if the locos are travelling in different directions.

I found I quickly got used to doing this, though sometimes with seven active locos it's difficult to remember which channels are inactive.

Rik
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
28,233
North West Norfolk
I don't usually leave my locos switched on - dunno why, but I don't: probably because I don't want to forget they're on and put them away still on. Did that once and 'cos the loco had the dreaded cab light :giggle::giggle: that you can't see during the day, over a period of weeks in da shed it drained the batteries completely beyond salvage and a new set was required :oops::oops::oops:
 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
17,856
72
St.Neots Cambridgeshire UK
Hi Jon
The default 'fumble' time when switching from one Selecta position to the next is 1 sec, but it can take 3 sec for the second loco to respond if there is a speed change. The length of fumble time can be changed by reprogramming the RX.

As Phil says, it's a good idea to switch to a completely different (unused) Selecta channel in between changing from one to another. You can the change the speed setting for the second loco without mucking up either loco's settings. This is particularly useful if the locos are travelling in different directions.

I found I quickly got used to doing this, though sometimes with seven active locos it's difficult to remember which channels are inactive.

Rik
Looks like my 5-10 second rule will work fine. In operation I would not do what I did the other day have 3 Deltang equipped locs all together and go from one to the other to confirm the fact that they can be swopped around apparently with few issues. What will occur is that one will run into a Station and stop. Points will be changed then I will go to where the other is sitting and drive it to the station where the first one just stopped. As that stopes I will then change points, look at my simplifier to see what is next by which time the pause between locomotives is likely to have been 5-10 seconds thus no problems.

However be interesting to know how and what in the myriad of options on Rx reprogramming is the ‘fumble‘ time. just had a look at the programming tables and nothing came to light.

Another option could be to have switched off locomotives on every other selection thus G1/3/5 etc 0 Gauge 2/4/6 would this solve those issues?

Finally going back to the start of this thread what Deltang option would be a suitable replacement for the Rx65?
 
JimmyB

JimmyB

Semi-Retired; more time for trains.
Finally going back to the start of this thread what Deltang option would be a suitable replacement for the Rx65?
Or if not Deltang, are there other similar suitable options. Currently I only have Deltang Tx, so I assume any DSM RX would bind.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
26,564
Tamworth, Staffs.
Or if not Deltang, are there other similar suitable options. Currently I only have Deltang Tx, so I assume any DSM RX would bind.
Most DSMn receivers will bind.. NONE will recognise 'Selecta' information, so you could only run one of these at a time, and would need to turn it OFF if you wanted to use one of your Deltang (Selecta) equipped loco's.

There are some offerings (from China, where else?) which have ESC's on the board, but you must take the current ratings of these with a large pinch of salt! - Many will not be H-bridge ESC's (low-off, one direction). So you may need to have a DPDT relay for motor direction.
For lighting, and trigger outputs, you will probably need external switch modules.

PhilP.
 
ge_rik

ge_rik

British narrow gauge (esp. Southwold and W&LLR)
However be interesting to know how and what in the myriad of options on Rx reprogramming is the ‘fumble‘ time. just had a look at the programming tables and nothing came to light.
Last column in first row of Menu 8

Another option could be to have switched off locomotives on every other selection thus G1/3/5 etc 0 Gauge 2/4/6 would this solve those issues?
It's whatever suits you. You can switch past the next active loco and on to an 'unactive' Selecta channel do your fumbling and then switch back. I'd avoid Ch6 for fumbling though as, for some reason, this seems to throw spanners in the works.

Finally going back to the start of this thread what Deltang option would be a suitable replacement for the Rx65?
Depends on what space you have available and what load you will be placing on it. If the worst comes to the worst, you could always use a Rx102 and a separate ESC

Rik
 
JimmyB

JimmyB

Semi-Retired; more time for trains.
Most DSMn receivers will bind.. NONE will recognise 'Selecta' information, so you could only run one of these at a time, and would need to turn it OFF if you wanted to use one of your Deltang (Selecta) equipped loco's.

There are some offerings (from China, where else?) which have ESC's on the board, but you must take the current ratings of these with a large pinch of salt! - Many will not be H-bridge ESC's (low-off, one direction). So you may need to have a DPDT relay for motor direction.
For lighting, and trigger outputs, you will probably need external switch modules.

PhilP.
Mmmmm! :speechless::speechless:
 
Tony Walsham

Tony Walsham

Manufacturer of RCS Radio Control.
25 Oct 2009
2,160
Casino, NSW
I used to sell quite a few Rx65's. I reckon they were/are a great bit of kit. Actually very reliable.
Problem for me was they kept on coming back with screwed up programming. Not surprising considering how complicated it was/is for many operators.
So I stopped selling them.
Eventually new versions came out that could not achieve the rated voltage conditions and had to be de-rated.
Then I stocked and very successfully sold the VIPER range. They are very reliable, but once Peter Spoerer retired, they became unavailable with fitted JST connectors.
Nowadays I use Fosworks Cobra-160 (30 watt) and Cobra-260 (100 watt) for Centre OFF ESC's. I have my own OMEGA-10 100 watt Low OFF ESC made for me by Fosworks. Easy to program and they work well between 6 volts and 24 volts. I do need to add protection diodes to the 100 watt ESC's.

Eventually there will be a 10 amp 24 volt ESC like the combined Rx/ESC Deltang hardware.
 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
17,856
72
St.Neots Cambridgeshire UK
Ah never got to menu 8 before, there is an awful lit to the Rx65 as Tony says. Have to say that thus far with 2 of my 3 I am very happy, the third one has been left awhile as I am still trying to get my head back round the programming. Other projects are taking priority over an 0 Gauge Hymec that it sits in.
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
28,233
North West Norfolk
Depends on what space you have available and what load you will be placing on it. If the worst comes to the worst, you could always use a Rx102 and a separate ESC

Rik
The Viper range is OK, I have them in two of my locos :nod::nod:
 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
17,856
72
St.Neots Cambridgeshire UK
well I read the programming bit on the Deltangs, but decided it was beyond my capability, and have never touch that side, just wire them up and run them straight out of the packets.
If you watch Rik’s vids it does become clearer.
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
28,233
North West Norfolk
If you watch Rik’s vids it does become clearer.
Fortunately, not necessary for my purposes :shake::shake:

WWNR operating procedures (battery power)

  1. Switch loco on
  2. Switch Tx on
  3. Gently start train, and proceed with caution out of station area
  4. Accelerate to desired speed
  5. Turn off Tx, and place in memorable position
  6. Pour drink
  7. Sit down and watch the train go by ..............
  8. Approx 30 minutes later retrieve Tx and switch on
  9. Slow down train as it enters station and bring to a stop
  10. Turn off, turn on loco on second train and repeat steps 1 - 9

:cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:
 
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JimmyB

JimmyB

Semi-Retired; more time for trains.
Having been for a stroll around the Micron site I have read the following which is encouraging:

"And the good news:
We want to reassure customers that there is a future and that your investment in Deltang receivers and transmitters will not be wasted.

Micron is developing a range of receivers using a modern chip, one that the manufacturer has committed to at least 20 years availability. The new transmitters and receivers will be compatible with existing Deltang installations: Micron transmitters will operate Deltang receivers and new Micron receivers can be operated by existing Deltang transmitters.

This work does take time and there is likely to be a gap between disappearance of a Deltang receiver and release of the Micron equivalent. We are working hard to make this gap as small as possible."
 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
17,856
72
St.Neots Cambridgeshire UK
Andy hinted that to me a few weeks back when I was ordering my latest batch but thought it prudent to not mention anything at the time. At least it is in the open now and we can hope for great things.

Sadly Jimmy I doubt it will help you with programming unless there is a drastic change in emphasis, but it is worth persevering and I had a lot of encouragement from both Andy and Ge_rik.
 
a98087

a98087

Registered
8 Nov 2009
1,639
33
Wiltshire
As PhilP has said and supplied to me,there is an alternative to to the rc65c. You use a rx102 and the fosworks esc.

The advantage is a very high current capacity - ideal for twin motor locos,
The disadvantage is you have two circuit boards, so no the ideal for locos with limited space.

Dan
 
ge_rik

ge_rik

British narrow gauge (esp. Southwold and W&LLR)
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
28,233
North West Norfolk
As PhilP has said and supplied to me,there is an alternative to to the rc65c. You use a rx102 and the fosworks esc.

The advantage is a very high current capacity - ideal for twin motor locos,
The disadvantage is you have two circuit boards, so no the ideal for locos with limited space.

Dan
Well, yes and no, Minister - I have a Viper ESC in this little chappie with very limited space - it happens to fit between the chassis members of an outside framed chassis (Essel Engineering in this case) and the battery pack is 9.6v 4/5 AR under the bonnet, the Deltang ESC is in the cab.

The charging socket and the on / off switch are in the cab on the dash board ;);)

PICT0003.JPG



The Banta crewcab in the background has 12v AA (2 x 6v packs vertically behind the wooden side panels, and originally had a Viper ESC but has been changed to a Deltang Rx/ESC (probably a 65) - and ironically, there's more room on that than there is in the slightly enlarged MDC Critter