Setting up in R/C. What's needed?

[Wobbleboxer]

Reading through a number of other threads about using R/C, I'm tempted to get a small R/C unit to run during the winter when track cleaning is too much trouble. What do I need to get started with R/C? I've run R/C cars in the past so am not a complete novice, except using in the railway environment.

My stock is all US steam era, but I'm thinking something like a small diesel Critter maybe. Any pointers gratefully received.

 

[CoggesRailway]

First do not apply (apart from possibly batteries) car kit to your train. I have kit that uses a standard transmitter as used for aircraft/cars. It works but is less than ideal. I also have a garden railway specific set up (cliff barker but I guess there are others) which is brilliant. Fine control, protypical speed gathering and slowing etc plus crusie control. If you go cliff barker all you need is a battery. Batteries are a subject all of their own. I think I have come down on the side of NimH but I also have lipo which is good too.

My recomdenation would be a meaty nimh battery and cliff barker installed IN the loco. You won't look back. Whatlep will be along soon, but if not PM him he is the master on all this.

 

[Madman]

Everything that Ian has said is accurate. He showed me the Cliff Barker set-up, and I think it's an excellent product. Very easy to understand and use. I will, however, would like to throw in a plug for Del Tapparo. His Railboss equippment is what I started with earlier this year. His site is;
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/DelTapparo/
As Ian said, you won't look back. I can't say much about Ni-mh batteries other than the cordless tools I use have them, and they are far superior to Ni-cad batteries. I am using Li-on batteries with much success. Here's a site that may help;
http://www.all-battery.com/li-ion18650148v4400mahpcbpreotectedrechargeablebatterywithbareleads
That said, I have found numerous Li-on battery packs on Ebay for far less than All-Battery's prices. They seem to be working just as well, but time will tell.

 

[Bram]

I have installed a Cliff Barker unit + batteries in a ??small diesel Critter, no probs, superb running and the lights work as well. Go for it

 

[yb281]

I have installed a Cliff Barker unit + batteries in a ??small diesel Critter, no probs, superb running and the lights work as well. Go for it

Just beware though - I saw what Bram did about 18 months ago with the Cliff Barker kit and now I'm about to go almost completely over to battery power. It's addictive.

 

[Wobbleboxer]

Thanks for the info and links, I'll do some investigating.

And no Mel I'm not planning on converting the whole roster

 

[yb281]

Thanks for the info and links, I'll do some investigating.

And no Mel I'm not planning on converting the whole roster

Neither was I at the beginning mate.

http://www.gscalecentral.net/m94293

 

[Wobbleboxer]

http://www.gscalecentral.net/m94293

Useful link, thanks.

Have you added a sound module yet, with the Cliff Barker system?

 

[yb281]

http://www.gscalecentral.net/m94293

Useful link, thanks.

Have you added a sound module yet, with the Cliff Barker system?

No. I've got a Mylocosound diesel soundcard, but have not fitted it yet. To be honest sound is something I can take or leave.

 

[beavercreek]

No. I've got a Mylocosound diesel soundcard, but have not fitted it yet. To be honest sound is something I can take or leave.

With the mylocosound you are almost leaving it........
only joking

 

[gregh]

Reading through a number of other threads about using R/C, I'm tempted to get a small R/C unit to run during the winter when track cleaning is too much trouble. What do I need to get started with R/C? I've run R/C cars in the past so am not a complete novice, except using in the railway environment.

My stock is all US steam era, but I'm thinking something like a small diesel Critter maybe. Any pointers gratefully received.

You might like to have a look at my web pages here:

http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/satr/2point4GHz.htm < Link To http://www.members.optusn...au/satr/2point4GHz.htm
They describe step by step how to use 2.4 GHz 'aircraft' type control system. I am using these as the cheapest and best way to do RC.
There's some of my ideas on batteries here too...
http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/satr/battery.htm < Link To http://www.members.optusn..com.au/satr/battery.htm

Squeezing RC and batteries into L'il critter could be difficult. I've found I seldom need more than 10V (ie 8 NiMH cells). I usually use 2200 mAh types. Here's a pic of an Aristo L'il Critter I 'double-ended'. 8 cells in one end. RC stuff in the other.

But if you just want to get something to run on batteries, why not skip RC at present and just use a forward/off/reverse switch?

 

[Tony Walsham]

You might also like to consider whether or not you want constant brightness directional lighting, programmable sound triggers, controllable rates of acceleration, controllable rates of braking, speed matching of locos for multiple heading, full throttle stick movement for each direction, plug in RX's - no servo leads, Switch off TX "cruising" and the ability to handle from 7.2 volts up to 30 volts if needed.
You can do all of those things with my RCS stuff. Reasonable prices too.

 

[whatlep]

First do not apply (apart from possibly batteries) car kit to your train. I have kit that uses a standard transmitter as used for aircraft/cars. It works but is less than ideal. I also have a garden railway specific set up (cliff barker but I guess there are others) which is brilliant. Fine control, protypical speed gathering and slowing etc plus crusie control. If you go cliff barker all you need is a battery. Batteries are a subject all of their own. I think I have come down on the side of NimH but I also have lipo which is good too.

My recomdenation would be a meaty nimh battery and cliff barker installed IN the loco. You won't look back. Whatlep will be along soon, but if not PM him he is the master on all this.

Ian rather overrates my level of knowledge, but I'd be glad to help having converted several locos now. I am not a fan of the 2.4GHz route, solely as the transmitters are so bulky, but - as with most things electronic - the best advice is to see and use as many systems as you can before buying. I use Cliff Barker stuff with Li-ion batteries (which is what Ian has too, not LiPo!) and that works fine for me.

Your decision on batteries (Li-ion or NiMH and conventional NiMH versus "low self discharge" NiMH) is very much a question of how often you will run and how organised you can be in advance of any possible run. For a more technical view, see my thread on Li-ion testing here: http://www.gscalecentral.net/m165095 .

Happy to chat via PM if that helps.

 

[Tony Walsham]

WiFi would be doable.
However, at present the only user hardware, as in what you actually hold in our hand, would have to be touch screen devices such as I Phone and I Pad.
From surveys Greg E and I have conducted separately, to a man, the interviewees rejected the idea of touch screens as not being user friendly.
You have to look at the screen to operate a control.
They are hard to see in bright daylight.
They eat batteries as they have to be left on all the time.
WiFi uses a lot of power.
Indoors maybe. Outdoors I doubt it.
Perhaps a discussion on WiFi would be better served in another thread, rather than hi-jacking this thread.

 

[beavercreek]

I am not a fan of the 2.4GHz route, solely as the transmitters are so bulky, but - as with most things electronic - the best advice is to see and use as many systems as you can before buying.

At the risk of seeming to sound like an Ad for the product.
The Aristo system works on 2.4Ghz and the handset is smaller than a Massoth navigator. The chips are a little bigger than a massoth XLS but about twice the thickness. Batteries of course are the same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcS4...e.com/watch?v=yXQhAjrSUhI&feature=related < Link To http://www.youtube.com/wa...bsp; (there are 8 vids in this demonstration/review)

 

[CoggesRailway]

What i don't like about standard rc kit (I have both systems) is that the levers are not designed for very slight increments.... I am pretty sure having a standard aircraft transmitter for trains will be seen as outmoded before long.

 

[yb281]

What i don't like about standard rc kit (I have both systems) is that the levers are not designed for very slight increments.... I am pretty sure having a standard aircraft transmitter for trains will be seen as outmoded before long.

Hopefully Ian. There was an excellent layout at this year's Llanfair exhibition that was ruined for me by the dreadful running qualities of the locos thanks to the operators using such transmitters. The acceleration and running speeds of the stock would have been fine for a Scalextric set, but not for a model railway. Why people still insist on using such things when there are so many excellent alternatives (as discussed here) is beyond me.

 

[Tony Walsham]

If you use the elevator channel for setting the direction and use the throttle stick purely for speed, the stick travel is double from off to full speed, which means you will have much finer speed control.
Plus, with the RCS system you can have even finer start and stop speed control with the infinitely variable momentum/inertia setting. This is set by the operator at will during operation.

 

[Wobbleboxer]

At the risk of seeming to sound like an Ad for the product.
The Aristo system works on 2.4Ghz and the handset is smaller than a Massoth navigator. The chips are a little bigger than a massoth XLS but about twice the thickness. Batteries of course are the same.

I'm using an Aristo TE now for my track power. Don't they do an onboard receiver? Would that be an easier (and cheaper) way to start? And why didn't I think of that before?

Thanks for all the other info everyone, very interesting stuff.

 

[CoggesRailway]

If you use the elevator channel for setting the direction and use the throttle stick purely for speed, the stick travel is double from off to full speed, which means you will have much finer speed control.
Plus, with the RCS system you can have even finer start and stop speed control with the infinitely variable momentum/inertia setting. This is set by the operator at will during operation.

That's interesting. What i am getting at is that you use something like your kit that is designed for railways as opposed to standard car/aircraft stuff. I have bought second hand such equipped locos and they are a bit hopeless.