Re overhead power lines

D

Dinas Bryn

Registered
Evening, I have got rid of my DR/OBB and have gone for RhB NG Main Line, I have reduced my layout and would like to put in the garage the overhead wires, looking at the LGB? items they are well out of my cost, have you any ideas please, I thought I could make the post of wood, look forward to seeing your ideas Les
 
Only thing is Les wood might look very chunky compared to the H girder used by the RhB, maybe a smaller section wood to make them look lighter?. B&Q do a range of aluminium extrusions that could be used to make lookalike masts with holes drilled through to take a catenary support wire and a short lenght of the angle for the carrier wire above that could be bolted on with small brackets or cut and slotted to the main upright. Rather than spend days soldering up the wires like Neil did on Klein Arosa.
You could just use fishing line to restrict the pantographs to about an inch up so they can't catch on anything inside or in the garden. Using fishing line means they will still pop down without having to remember to do anything before running onto the outside line.
 
I'm looking at putting up wires on our new to be club layout. Likewise, the LGb units will cost far to much for the amount needed, so any ideas would be good to see! :)
 
I made mine. Not that I have any erected yet but it was the cost of the commercialy made ones that made up my mind. Also I wanted "Victorian Ornate" style but they could be made to "minimalist modern" for lots less effort and less cost. Look at the way I made mine using aluminium tube and bronze welding rod needs only a hacksaw, file and drill with a few drops of superglue...


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Les did you not have a word wiyh Steve Warrington He has a lot of the RHB type . Thee other option is 1/2" (25mm)copper tube for the lower patrs then reduce to 3/8" (10 mm) then 1/4" (6mm) for the arm

By the way yours look good Trev:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
 
Mnay thanks for your ideas, I will go to the B&Q after Christmas, how often do you need posts? I have a 5 road yard and about 20 foot long, would you use fishing line in the yard? I haven't tried to see if I can get the loco out yet but I know I haven't got any spare room for the first 40ft as it is covered and I had to cut out the roof surports to get the small shunter out, I know I could remove the roof but it keeps the stock dry when shunting Les
 
Hi Phil I didn't speak to steve, I was working on what you had paid, I have got some tube here when keith was trying to put those lights you have on the new layout so they might do the job, I can't remember when you were over with your stock if you got out of the garage before you hit the bridge, can you? Les ps just remembered I only had a single road for the covered area now have 2 roads but was the hole in the garage big enough? Les
 
Les, spacing depends on what you use for the catenary. Realistic catenary on a straight might be several coaches long but it's under tension and the springs on real pantographs are nowhere near as strong as the LGB ones ;) It will depend on what you use but as I said before if you restrict the panto graphs with a bit of fishing line so they sit just beneath it or put virtually no pressure on it you can use very thin wire or even cord. Beware uncoupling though as it turns into a large catapult!
On curves they have to be closer to keep the wire between the rails as it's a series of straight lines rather than curving like the rails. Also note it doesn't run straight but zig zags from one side to the other on straights to even out wear.
 
Trev's posts are classic. When I had overhead in my garden, before grandchildren and complaining gardeners, I used the simplest methods I could devise. 1/2" copper tubing was used for the posts, along with 1/2" PVC tubing. It depended on what I had left over from projects. The poles were about two feet in length, driven into the ground about half way. In order to drive them easily and make sure they were plumb, I first drove a 5/8" diameter steel bar, with a bullet shaped point, into the gound. 5/8" is the outside diameter of 1/2" tubing. At one point I was able to buy a couple dozen LGB standard catenary posts and used these in conjunction with my home made posts.
For contact wire I used 12 gauge stranded copper wire, available at any electrical supply house. Or in my case available from any friendly electrician on the job. Since I was the superintendent on the job, most of them were friendly. Before I would use the wire for the catenary, I would pull out a length of about 75', clamp it in a drill chuck and fasten the other end to the barn door handle. With tension on the wire I would turn the drill on. This action tightened the spiral winding of the strands, making it somewhat stiffer and easier to work with.

My preferred method of building the system was simply to install posts at each end of a straight run of track, no matter what lentgh that might be. Tie the wire around each of these posts so that it was in tension. The posts had turnbuckles anchored into the gound to keep the wire in tension on longer runs. Curved track required a bit more geometry.

I would by happy to post some photos if anyone cares to see how it was all done.
 
Les the spacing is about 680mm the length of the figure 8 running wire. the suspension cable i used was brazing wire 1/16 with .5mm hangers bent and soldered together. Dont forget either the suspension wire dips
The masts are 56300 (tilt type ) 56301 and the base to suit

It took me one winter to do mine taking about 20mins each wire

I also find that it is best to over lap them on the clips puting a little kink on the over hang
Sorry to Trev we seem to be hijacking his thread
 
tramcar trev said:
Chaps, I use this site as a good resource for overhead. It is American but it has heaps of usefull data such as pole spacing and location.

http://www.trolleyville.com/tv/school/catenary_construction/index.shtml < Link To http://www.trolleyville.c...nstruction/index.shtml
Click to expand...

I got a kick out of the rule that says no wire shall be strung until all of the track, sidewalks, etc. have been laid. Those of us that like to make changes once in awhile, would have some difficulty with that rule.
 
Madman said:
tramcar trev said:
Chaps, I use this site as a good resource for overhead. It is American but it has heaps of usefull data such as pole spacing and location.

http://www.trolleyville.com/tv/school/catenary_construction/index.shtml < Link To http://www.trolleyville.c...nstruction/index.shtml
Click to expand...

I got a kick out of the rule that says no wire shall be strung until all of the track, sidewalks, etc. have been laid. Those of us that like to make changes once in awhile, would have some difficulty with that rule.
Click to expand...
Two observations;
1) This is not my thread so no one is hijacking it but the chap with a Welsh Name may be upset by me hijacking his thread....
2) Reference the rule quoted above; it may be difficult to work with but I can give you my assurance if you are building a tramway with street scenery etc its the only practical way to do it. This is why I'm farting around so much, working under complex overhead is not fun at all. I will endeavour to complete everything that the overhead would impede the instalation of, I may have to work in sections but as I'm, for example, having the space between my rails "paved" with the stone tiles, that in itself is a huge task.... I'm beginning to worry that I will never see a tram run under OH on the tramway....
Now if you are running a single catenary wire off bracket arm poles where you can get at things from at least one side without risk of damaging your overhead that's a different kettle of Bassa....

3) Ok I'm slipping this one in... re wooden poles check out the wooden poles on the micro dockyard scene, they are really so simple yet look brilliant and would be great indoors. Towards the bottom of the page: http://www.carendt.com/microplans/index.html under industrial railways/ traction tramways
 
Overhead power lines

I thought some people might like to see a full sized right angle turn of the overhead line.
This is from the RhB website about the Google StreetView project

http://www.rhb.ch/Street-View-Rhaetische-Bahn.1908.0.html?&L=4 < Link To http://www.rhb.ch/Street-...n.1908.0.html?&L=4

Notice that even at 1:1, its necessary to spread out the vertical posts. Naturally this is required at very low radii, when the train speed is severely restricted.

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Long ago when I was fortunate enough to work with 25kV AM3s the pantographs were painted with tell tale yellow paint at the extremities where no contact with the overhead line was expected / allowed. Before H&S was invented I got to see this; we did not observe a 2m maximum safe working height. Perhaps its different now?

Remembering that the 1:1 overhead components were much smaller than the bits that held the rails together, I wonder if we will see G scale four bolt fishplates to connect rails ? Or sadly will we have to admit that robustness and practicality require that even in G scale overhead lines are not to scale.

Its a toy, an impression if you like, but a G scale working layout or any other is not, and cannot be, a scale model.

The objective is to have fun!
 
Re:Overhead power lines

I agree, the object is to create the impression, even the 'atmosphere'... If you look at a street corner or intersection for trams using trolley poles the overhead is virtually a spiderweb of wire and insulators far to complex to recreate in any but 1:1... you can however create a reasonable representation and incoorporate other detail to draw the rivet counters eyes away from the parts of the overhead left out, hence all the work I have done on my poles....
 
Re:Overhead power lines

Pole diameters also increased to take the strain of the pull-offs. Traction poles for tramways used to have the designations, A, B, C, D et al. from 6" to 12"! One such 90 degree turn on the Bradford tramway system was nicknamed 'cobweb corner' and was said to block out the light:rolf:

As for four bolt fishplates, there was some discussion about them and observations on the forum quite a while back. The manufacturer provide one oval and one round hole either side of the rail joint - negating any expansion or contraction possibilities!
 
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