Question about powering the line ?

Jereffuse said:
lol my rails are brand news and nickel plated so I think this is something I don't hve to worry about
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OK - next obvious question - how are the track lengths joined? Is there potential (please excuse the pun) for voltage drop there?

It's sensible to get the easy bits out of the way first :nod::nod:
 
Greg Elmassian said:
The question was posed: do your trains run faster near the power feed, than further away, or are the speeds consistent throughout the layout?

If the OP would please answer this question, then speculation/comments on voltage drop can be appropriate.

Greg
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That was answered by the OP in post 9, Greg......

Jon.
 
When you run the locos, specifically the LGB ones, with the lights on, do they flicker (switch on/off) when you change the speed?

Both of the LGB models listed do indeed have mfx decoders and it is my understanding that they default to 28 speed steps in DCC mode. Using MTS3 with a LGB handset will only generate 14 speed steps.
 
muns said:
When you run the locos, specifically the LGB ones, with the lights on, do they flicker (switch on/off) when you change the speed?

Both of the LGB models listed do indeed have mfx decoders and it is my understanding that they default to 28 speed steps in DCC mode. Using MTS3 with a LGB handset will only generate 14 speed steps.
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So what does that mean in performance terms, Muns? Leaving aside the well-known issue of the lights, does the decoder see the 14 speed steps as the first 14 of the 28 range it is expecting, so that full throttle is only half the expected maximum (which would account for the OP's experiences) - or does it simply divide the total voltage into 14 steps rather than 28, so the maximum setting still gives the same top speed?
Jon.
 
Rhinochugger said:
OK - next obvious question - how are the track lengths joined? Is there potential (please excuse the pun) for voltage drop there?

It's sensible to get the easy bits out of the way first :nod::nod:
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this is thiel rail with thiel joiners, I don't think it comes from here

tn153-thiel.jpg
 
Zerogee said:
So what does that mean in performance terms, Muns? Leaving aside the well-known issue of the lights, does the decoder see the 14 speed steps as the first 14 of the 28 range it is expecting, so that full throttle is only half the expected maximum (which would account for the OP's experiences) - or does it simply divide the total voltage into 14 steps rather than 28, so the maximum setting still gives the same top speed?
Jon.
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well, well, well that begins to be very complicated to me now, I know what you're talking about but this is something I never understand what is it exactly when I read the booklet.
 
Zerogee said:
That was answered by the OP in post 9, Greg......

Jon.
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So post 21 is also superfluous, no issue with joiners. So we can stop going down that road as of post #9.

So the train runs slow. I have had one weird issue where a loco came with VMAX set less than 255/0, i.e. the top speed was limited from the manufacturer... have only seen this once in my entire DCC career but is possible.

Greg
 
Greg Elmassian said:
So post 21 is also superfluous, no issue with joiners. So we can stop going down that road as of post #9.

So the train runs slow. I have had one weird issue where a loco came with VMAX set less than 255/0, i.e. the top speed was limited from the manufacturer... have only seen this once in my entire DCC career but is possible.

Greg
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how did you solve that?
 
Oh, it was simple, just set to 255... it appears that the USA Trains GG-1 locomotives had this default setting, i.e. they ran slow out of the box. Someone messed up on the default programming. I think it was set to 127 or something. This affected top speed on DCC and DC... thus people were plenty confused.

This is most likely not the problem here, but when solving a problem, I check everything, even the "crazy" stuff. I suspect that the loco is actually going an adequate scale speed in this case, as opposed to many G scale locos that will easily hit 200 scale miles per hour.

Greg
 
Hi,

I saw your railjoiners from Thiel.
They look nice but are not so effective or stable.

They conduct much less electricity than the track itself.
Because the effective profile is much lesser.
So with each railjoiner you lose some power.

You may try some nickelplated railjoiners from Massoth.
They have almost the same effective profile as the track.

Don't clean your nickel plated track with the LGB rubber block or something similar. You will destroy the nickelplated surface.
Just use a soft broom.

Groeten,
Wilco
 
Perception can be a strange thing. I've noticed that my locos appear "slower" now that I've got them running outside on a relatively large as compared to indoors layout. But, the side-cranks are still churning away!

Phil S.
 
You make a good point, Phil. It leads to my question: Paul, could you shoot a video of your train so we can all see your slow speeds for ourselves?
 
At the connection, it's not the thickness of the metal, but the surface area for conduction.

The Theil joiners have a huge surface contact area compared to other joiners, thus should be excellent in terms of electrical resistance... as long as the bolts are tight and dirt does not get in.

Yes with ANY joining system you lose some power at each joiner, no matter what type, including soldered joints. So this statement is a "red herring", what is important is the resistance of the joint after assembly.

By the way, when clean and oxide free, nickel is a worse conductor than brass. This is not as simple as metal type, it's the method of fastening, the resistance to oxidation and keeping the connection tight and contaminate free.

Greg


Wilco said:
Hi,

I saw your railjoiners from Thiel.
They look nice but are not so effective or stable.

They conduct much less electricity than the track itself.
Because the effective profile is much lesser.
So with each railjoiner you lose some power.

You may try some nickelplated railjoiners from Massoth.
They have almost the same effective profile as the track.

Don't clean your nickel plated track with the LGB rubber block or something similar. You will destroy the nickelplated surface.
Just use a soft broom.

Groeten,
Wilco
Click to expand...
 
Greg Elmassian said:
So post 21 is also superfluous, no issue with joiners. So we can stop going down that road as of post #9.

So the train runs slow. I have had one weird issue where a loco came with VMAX set less than 255/0, i.e. the top speed was limited from the manufacturer... have only seen this once in my entire DCC career but is possible.

Greg
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The setting for top speed - Vmax (CV5 on Massoth) often has a default of about 200. This allows the constant speed/back EMF to operate correctly at near top speeds. If you set the CV to 255 (Maximum) there is no voltage left to enable the system to increase power when the loco slows for a hill or curve.
 
stockers said:
The setting for top speed - Vmax (CV5 on Massoth) often has a default of about 200. This allows the constant speed/back EMF to operate correctly at near top speeds. If you set the CV to 255 (Maximum) there is no voltage left to enable the system to increase power when the loco slows for a hill or curve.
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It is one if my problem I don't know how to change CV's
and they don't climb very little hills :-(
 
Greg Elmassian said:
At the connection, it's not the thickness of the metal, but the surface area for conduction.

The Theil joiners have a huge surface contact area compared to other joiners, thus should be excellent in terms of electrical resistance... as long as the bolts are tight and dirt does not get in.

Yes with ANY joining system you lose some power at each joiner, no matter what type, including soldered joints. So this statement is a "red herring", what is important is the resistance of the joint after assembly.

By the way, when clean and oxide free, nickel is a worse conductor than brass. This is not as simple as metal type, it's the method of fastening, the resistance to oxidation and keeping the connection tight and contaminate free.

Greg
Click to expand...
This is what I've ben told about thiel joiners when I bought them and they effectyvely have a great surface of conductivity
 
phils2um said:
Perception can be a strange thing. I've noticed that my locos appear "slower" now that I've got them running outside on a relatively large as compared to indoors layout. But, the side-cranks are still churning away!

Phil S.
Click to expand...
Hi,

I've noticed that too but I'm comparing with videos on youtube I've seen with the same locos, this is why I think they are slower
 
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