Planning new Garden railway

When I moved into garden railways, I decided to go the whole hog and attempt to integrate the railway into a credible landscape, as far from "baseboards" as possible. I should immediately acknowledge my debt to the late Peter Jones, the cover illustration of whose "Practical Garden Railways" was my instant inspiration.
My garden is slightly sloped, requiring a very modest amount of civil engineering. Accordingly I used up the stone from my rockery, from a number of friends' gardens, and as much as was available from other legitimate sources. Where necessary, behind some of these I used lightweight concrete blocks, which have the virtues of ready availability (B&...lineup?), cheapness and ... light weight. Cement was used where necessary to level the trackbed, and from the back of the rocks to hold them in place without "pointing" being visible from the front, although it still is in some places. What I would remark upon is the sheer volume of infill required for even the most modest raised layout. While my knees nowadays might appreciate a greater degree of elevation, I like to pretend that I am in charge of a real railway in a real location, albeit a small one, and in all humility I believe I have succeeded, at least to my own satisfaction. I do use "railway sleepers" elsewhere in the garden for purely garden landscaping purposes, and regard them as very effective, but not for a layout. There are a couple of areas still in need of improvement, but I still prefer my approach to alternatives.
 
i have a large garden railway using real sleepers as retaining walls up to 4 ft high.
Positives:
  1. They are very solid and will see me out
  2. they retain soil well. I have them stacked up to 4 ft high
  3. you can easily run track along the top of them
  4. you can stack then on their broad bottoms (very strong) or sides (narrower and less strong but fewer sleepers needed)
  5. Easy to fix together with timberlock landscaping screws
  6. I like the idea of my garden railway running on genuine old sleepers
Negatives
  1. They are very heavy and you will need help to move and position them
  2. They are not cheap. best it to buy them in bulk as delivery is the same for one or 50
  3. they can ooze tar in hot weather (not a popular with visiting mums of kids and my wife but we now warn everyone
  4. Quality of old sleepers is very variable, some will be poor
  5. sizes can vary even in the same load
  6. difficult to do curves
  7. hard work to cut (even with a chain saw and the dirt on the sleepers damage and blunt the chain very fast)
for areas where there is no retaining wall needed I use 3x3 treated posts linked by 2x1 screwed into the posts and topped by marine ply cut to the right shape. This is less expensive and much faster to put up.

AC
 
adverse camber said:
i have a large garden railway using real sleepers as retaining walls up to 4 ft high.
Positives:
  1. They are very solid and will see me out
  2. they retain soil well. I have them stacked up to 4 ft high
  3. you can easily run track along the top of them
  4. you can stack then on their broad bottoms (very strong) or sides (narrower and less strong but fewer sleepers needed)
  5. Easy to fix together with timberlock landscaping screws
  6. I like the idea of my garden railway running on genuine old sleepers
Negatives
  1. They are very heavy and you will need help to move and position them
  2. They are not cheap. best it to buy them in bulk as delivery is the same for one or 50
  3. they can ooze tar in hot weather (not a popular with visiting mums of kids and my wife but we now warn everyone
  4. Quality of old sleepers is very variable, some will be poor
  5. sizes can vary even in the same load
  6. difficult to do curves
  7. hard work to cut (even with a chain saw and the dirt on the sleepers damage and blunt the chain very fast)
for areas where there is no retaining wall needed I use 3x3 treated posts linked by 2x1 screwed into the posts and topped by marine ply cut to the right shape. This is less expensive and much faster to put up.

AC
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Sleepers are fine :nod::nod::nod:

As you say, with the genuine ones, the size can vary, but they seem to come in two weights - heavy and b****y heavy :whew::whew::whew::whew:

The (now lifted) WWSR was built almost entirely on old sleepers - for curves, I took my minimum radius LGB R3 (8ft) and used two pieces of card cut to the width of a sleeper; I maneuvered these two pieces underneath the curve, until the track was sitting within both pieces, then marked the angle of cut - then cut the sleepers and hey presto, the track ran along the top >:)>:)

I only used that method where I had to have the minimum curve, elsewhere, I just laid the sleepers, and used a mixture of 10fts and 8fts to make the curve work.

DSCF0007.JPG
 
Rhinochugger said:
Sleepers are fine :nod::nod::nod:

As you say, with the genuine ones, the size can vary, but they seem to come in two weights - heavy and b****y heavy :whew::whew::whew::whew:

The (now lifted) WWSR was built almost entirely on old sleepers - for curves, I took my minimum radius LGB R3 (8ft) and used two pieces of card cut to the width of a sleeper; I maneuvered these two pieces underneath the curve, until the track was sitting within both pieces, then marked the angle of cut - then cut the sleepers and hey presto, the track ran along the top >:)>:)

I only used that method where I had to have the minimum curve, elsewhere, I just laid the sleepers, and used a mixture of 10fts and 8fts to make the curve work.

View attachment 229338
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How long did it last? Were the sleepers fixed at all? Hopefully I'll soon be rebuilding my line, so I'm getting the questions in early;)
 
Paul M said:
How long did it last? Were the sleepers fixed at all? Hopefully I'll soon be rebuilding my line, so I'm getting the questions in early;)
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I think the line was down for 6 or 7 years before we moved, and I left the sleepers in place when I lifted the track as they framed the garden planting. The original idea was to overcome the 2ft change in level down the 30 ft length of the garden, so the sleepers were fur deep at the bottom running to ground level at the top.

I didn't fix them in any way, but they were not retaining large amounts of soil :shake::shake:
 
For more than two sleepers, you definitely need to fix them together in some way..

As stated, cutting / drilling / moving can be difficult..
 
PhilP said:
For more than two sleepers, you definitely need to fix them together in some way..

As stated, cutting / drilling / moving can be difficult..
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Self weight can do it if you're not retaining soil.

The WWSR went up to four high and none were fixed :nod::nod:

However, if you're using new timber in sleeper sizes, then you'll need to fix them - reclaimed railway sleepers are a lot heavier than 8" x 4" timber baulks - I've used the latter for parts of the WWNR ;);)
 
Paul M said:
Sorry I've just seen another picture you posted in another thread. Looks good and doesn't interfere with the general garden use
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It suited this particular garden - the WWNR hasn't followed the same pattern :shake::shake:
 
Hi I have now moved house and are getting ready to commence work in the garden on the new railway! I will probably be using a raised bed, made at the front by new sleepers and at the rear by blocks. It will be 600mm high. I intend to backfill with hardcore and then but put a couple of inches of smaller gravel onto the top flush with the top of the sleepers and blocks. I will then lay the track on horticultural grit as ballast. Do you think that this would work or are there any other ideas out there? Any thoughts welcome!
Thanks,
Mark
 
markrussell1966 said:
I intend to backfill with hardcore and then but put a couple of inches of smaller gravel onto the top flush with the top of the sleepers and blocks. I will then lay the track on horticultural grit as ballast. Mark
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Avoid "rounded" gravel/pea shingle. Your top layer of horticultural grit (sharp edged) will work its way down through it and disappear over time. Made that mistake when I started, had to dig it out and replace or put a permeable membrane between it and the top layer of grit where practical. Max
 
Compact the lower level gravel well.. - You can almost make this level with your top surface. It WILL settle, and you want to have to top-up as little as possible.
Then a membrane..
Then your sharp grit for ballast, and your track..

It will move / settle over time.

Depending on how much sun / wind it gets, it will tend to be very dry. - Are you intending any planting?
 
I would be tempted to follow Nick Trudgeon method when starting out new. Base of Concrete Gravel Boards then the 8 shaped Building Blocks for the Track base. Use more Conctete Gravel Boards for Track Base. Your method as described for the rear and front will work fine then but as said use Membrane to keep you Horticultural Grit separeted at the top. Though I have not used the 8's I could have, but the principles are seen in my Build Thread linked below in Blue. I used Blocks as my track base all cemented up in the Rockeries, much more work then the 8 method.
 
Depends if you want to plant anything in your raised beds alongside the track. I like seeing trains winding their way though the undergrowth and so I backfilled my raised beds with soil so I could plant dwarf trees, shrubs and foliage.

Rik

PS My trackbed is concrete 'breeze' blocks to which the track is screwed. It means I can lay flexible track without the need for a rail bender. I then apply ballast afterwards.
 
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I would be intending to do some planting so would I be better off backfilling to around 5” lower than the top of the retaining wall with hardcore. Then laying concrete blocks onto a mortar bed making them flush with the top of the retaining wall. Then laying the track onto this as a more solid base followed by ballasting. I could then backfill with soil for vegetation etc. Any buildings etc I could use the concrete blocks again for the bases. Your Thoughts?
Thanks,
Mark
 
I would be tempted to build up in concrete blocks (a la stonehenge style on a good foundation) for the track bed and fill in with hardcore.

Or if you want to use the hardcore for a total fill (less the height of the trackbed blocks) you need a Whacker Plate to consolidate the hardcore.
 
I'm not sure of the reasoning behind the hardcore. If you were laying foundations for a path or a building, then hardcore would be useful as a firm foundation for load bearing. If the hardcore is something like compacted crusher-run then you may end up with problems with drainage in your beds. If you have a load of loose rubble which you want to lose, then it might be a useful place to get rid of it, and it might aid drainage a bit like crocks in the bottom of a plant pot. However, backfilling the raised bed with soil (or even some manure then soil) will give your plants some decent nourishment, particularly if you're planning on putting in some dwarf conifers, shrubs and things like hebes.


Rik
 
markrussell1966 said:
I would be intending to do some planting so would I be better off backfilling to around 5” lower than the top of the retaining wall with hardcore. Then laying concrete blocks onto a mortar bed making them flush with the top of the retaining wall. Then laying the track onto this as a more solid base followed by ballasting. I could then backfill with soil for vegetation etc. Any buildings etc I could use the concrete blocks again for the bases. Your Thoughts?
Thanks,
Mark
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Think that the concepts you are proposing are sort of on the mark. But I would always get a firm foundation in for my trackbed which suggests for your Back Wall, Trackbed and Front the. You will see just how much soil has been excavated giving you a feel for how much will need to be lost. Remember that the stuff expands on contact with a shovel and will take some time to compact again.

On one of my Rockeries I am still having to level my Windmill that sits on its own Concrete bought with it round Base just on Soil that over the 3-4 years that it has been in place has compacted unevenly over those years. I keep on lifting it and putting varying Paving Flag bits in an attempt to keep it "afloat" in a level way as it were. I see already that last years efforts have not worked so I may need to do a proper base of a Concrete Slab here with the soil well tamped in.

I can see difficulties over time with a lot of Hardcore at the bottom with no firmness, my suggestion of Gravel Boards is sound so long as you cut a small Trench and Tamp that well before putting in said Gravel Boards. Suggest you try to get a copy of Nick Trudgian's book for idea's, though his line is very big the concepts will work in a smaller space.
image.jpeg
I should say that I have never been to or met Nick but I do greatly admire his line and concepts.
 
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