Massoth smoke generators...How do you rate them?

R

RH Prague

Central European. the station pub is Czech !!
28 Oct 2009
323
13
Prague
The pulsed generators are a bit expensive - and that's if one can get them, Massoth are listing them as out of stock.

What about their standard ones, would people say they are superior to LGB?

Currently I need to replace smoke generators in my two ZB U class locos (Raimund and no 2.) Both now have Massoth chips.

Would be interested in all thoughts/experiences.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
24,652
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Tamworth, Staffs.
I suppose if you want 'cylinder smoke', then the latest offerings might be considered worth it?

The problem (in my eyes) is our loco's are so small, and many run them too fast, that the smoke effect (like the sound) becomes indistinct.


As for the standard smoke unit (that fits in the chimney) I would search for Seuthe, as these tend to be cheaper, than either LGB or Massoth units.

PhilP.
 
Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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It depends on what you want, if a small wisp of smoke that does not vary with speed or load is ok, then get a simple heater.

The pulsed smoke units give a lot more realism, and you pay for the extra complexity to do so.

You can also directly drive a fan and heater from most larger decoders, which is inexpensive if you can find surplus smoke units, here in the US we use USA Trains and Aristo, and MTH units, all of which you probably cannot get, sorry.

Below is a USA trains unit, with no electronics, driven directly from the large scale decoder that is powering the loco

 
dunnyrail

dunnyrail

DOGS, Garden Railways, Steam Trains, Jive Dancing,
25 Oct 2009
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Smoke is a bit gimmicky, looks good for a while but if you are in for a good long running session you would need to keep topping up and there lies the rub. Getting the oil inside mixing with the chip if it overflows not good. Enjiy for a whike but then forget em. So expensive ones, nah.

But that is my personal view.
 
Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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Well, you do indeed need to refill every so often, and especially when you amp up the output, but there is where if that is an issue, you get ones with a larger reservoir:



Lots of options many people do not realize. I prefer metal reservoirs.

Also, in the method I prefer (for cost and control and performance) I use direct connections to the fan and heater, thus there is no electronics to hurt from overfilling.

I get many smoke units free from installers that remove them for the battery powered people who cannot devote an amp to the smoke unit (yes the smoke unit can draw as much or more than the motor)

This fact and the fact that I use the control from the main decoder, not paying for the extra built in "chip" gives me a cheaper, more controllable, more reliable solution.

So, there are many options above just buying an expensive unit from Massoth, and it can look great!


Greg
 
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R

RH Prague

Central European. the station pub is Czech !!
28 Oct 2009
323
13
Prague
That last one is hugely impressive, Greg. Is it your loco?

If anyone has fitted Massoth pulse generators it would be interesting to see videos of them in action. Massoth also claim that you can set them for use in diesel locos. I am really curious as to what that looks like. I'm not sure where the smoke would even emit from, looking at my V52s and OBB 2091...
 
idlemarvel

idlemarvel

Neither idle nor a marvel
13 Jul 2015
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I fitted one to a Saxon IVK, I'll see if I can find the video. I quite like smoke generators on steam locos, wheel synchronized pulse even better but standard LGB / Seuthe are okay too. The grandchildren especially love them.
 
D

Dan

Registered
28 Jan 2010
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Eastern MA
I use Zimo decoders and they have programmable 3 levels of heater voltages and 3 levels of fan control (decoder reads back emf from the motor). I do control the older LGB stacks with 3 different heats, (idle, run, heavy load).
 
AustrianNG

AustrianNG

Director of my railway
16 Sep 2015
905
56
Wirral
I have used Seuthe, LGB and Massoth standard smoke generators, Seuthe are usually cheaper than the others - they all look exactly alike.
All my chipped locos have smoke, some are directly wired to the track power (which being digital is always at full voltage).

IMG_0201.JPG
 
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Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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So you are talking the simple heater types, which are basically a tube and a heater inside:

1582227191632.png


But the question was about the fan driven smoke generators, which normally have a wick around a heater and then a fan pulsing on and off to force the smoke out:


 
R

RH Prague

Central European. the station pub is Czech !!
28 Oct 2009
323
13
Prague
Well I was interested in people's experiences of both types, to help weigh up whether it's worth trying a pulsed unit, so all the responses have been helpful. I took on board that results indoors are always going to be much more impressive - since I'm outside all the time, that points to sticking with the regular units. That said, Mr AustrianNG AustrianNG always seems to coax far more copious smoke from his regular units than I ever manage, is that one above wired directly to track power?
 
Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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Sorry, I stand corrected. The plain heater types have to be run pretty hard to look even close to realistic.

Indoors you do not have the breeze to dissipate the smoke, so the volume looks greater, but nothing beats realism of having the smoke volume go up and down in sync with the cylinders, chuff, and just the load on the loco. You get what you pay for.

Outside, the plain units just are wimpy unless you blast them with full voltage (usually this means constant voltage on the track) and still a breeze will dissipate them

When you run them hard, then you have to be more careful of keeping them full, and the simple tubes need frequent refilling, as opposed to the fan driven ones which have larger reservoirs for the fluid.

Greg
 
AustrianNG

AustrianNG

Director of my railway
16 Sep 2015
905
56
Wirral
most of my smoke units are Massoth or Seuthe 24 volt rating.
the one in the picture is 24 volt wired directly to the track (LGB 111)
Here is a video of two Stainz with 24 volt units.....


Well I was interested in people's experiences of both types, to help weigh up whether it's worth trying a pulsed unit, so all the responses have been helpful. I took on board that results indoors are always going to be much more impressive - since I'm outside all the time, that points to sticking with the regular units. That said, Mr AustrianNG AustrianNG always seems to coax far more copious smoke from his regular units than I ever manage, is that one above wired directly to track power?