I bought a Massoth Control system last April (2021) that included the 1210Z Central Station and the Dimax 1200T Power Supply. I also have a Dimax Navigator Handset. However, earlier this year it started developing an annoying habit. When switched on the Central Station goes though the starting-up process, stopping with the red light illuminated. Obviously nothing will operate in this position, so I turned the machine off and back on again. Lo and behold the system started up as it should. Now it does this every time I try to use it. I contacted the UK company who I bought it from and they assured me this was quite normal, and that I would have to switch off and on again to use the equipment. I wasn’t happy about this so I checked with the manufacturers, Massoth. It seems that the equipment operates in this way, as Massoth gave me the same information. It didn’t operate in this way when I first bought it, so I don’t understand why it should do it now. I paid over £1100 for the system, not including the handset, and I wouldn’t expect to have to turn it off and back on to get it to work properly. Has anyone had this problem please, or have any ideas as to what is causing this? It is still under guarantee until the end of March.
Massoth. Central Station problems
- Thread starter LGB-Phil
- Start date
Which means that the OP, finds this, really, really, really annoying..
Something has obviously changed, IF this did not originally occur..
I would ask myself, 'what has changed?'
Am I turning things on in a different sequence?
What does the manual say the red-light indicates? - Does it give any suggestions?
Do you get the same result, if you unplug the track connection-block?
Have you added anything to the layout?
Where is the equipment kept? - Ambient conditions.. A cold (possible damp) out-building? A frequently hot loft, perhaps?
PhilP
Something has obviously changed, IF this did not originally occur..
I would ask myself, 'what has changed?'
Am I turning things on in a different sequence?
What does the manual say the red-light indicates? - Does it give any suggestions?
Do you get the same result, if you unplug the track connection-block?
Have you added anything to the layout?
Where is the equipment kept? - Ambient conditions.. A cold (possible damp) out-building? A frequently hot loft, perhaps?
PhilP
Greg Elmassian
Guest
well the other 2 have now magically disappeared!
Greg Elmassian
Guest
No offense, but if this is consistently happening, and Massoth has told you to sod off, you are kind of stuck.
Like Mark said, start disconnecting things until you have nothing but the most basic parts that allow you to turn it on. (the fewest components).
I would wonder that this may have happened with a firmware update.
Greg
Like Mark said, start disconnecting things until you have nothing but the most basic parts that allow you to turn it on. (the fewest components).
I would wonder that this may have happened with a firmware update.
Greg
My apologies. I did put it on somewhere but wasn’t getting any replies. Someone suggested moving it to the dcc forum so I did that but obviously I forgot to delete the original one. I’m very sorry about that. It wasn’t intentional. I’m afraid age is against me when trying to do things on the computer.
Thanks for your reply. There is only one connection to the track, as well as the transmitter/receiver for the Navigator. As you suggested I disconnected the track but still the same. I’ve tried turning it on without the handset being switched on, and by turning the handset on first but no change.
Hi LGB-Phil - I have two DiMax Central Stations, the older 800z and the 1210z, and neither of them require a "double activation." Sometime seems amiss to me.
So, you tried disconnecting your DCC output wires to your layout and then connecting it to a separate short piece of track........and it still does it? Do you also have a the output to the Programming Track wired up to a piece of track? Verify that you have the wires in the Command Station's connectors wired correctly in the right terminals for both the DCC Output and the Programming Track. The do have + and - terminals shown, so you might try reversing the wire connections. The manual also states to use a higher AWG wire for the DCC Power Supply's connection to the Command Station.
I'm wondering if it could be the Massoth DC Power Supply might be causing it. Can you try another DC power supply up to 24 volts, Max 12 Amps, to see if the same condition occurs?
If all the above fails, I'd email hotline@massoth.de again and state that you want to return the command station under their warranty service.........see what they say. You'd have to pay for the shipping to Germany and the return shipping, but it might be worth shipping it to them to check it out. You'll need to fill out the warranty service little card to send with the item. I've used their warranty service many times over the last several years and gotten good service.
Thanks for your reply. It is the same when nothing is connected. I’m not too good with computers but I’ll ask a knowledgeable friend about the firmware update. Thank you for the suggestion.
It is the same whether track is connected or not. I don’t understand how both the company I bought it from and Massoth can say it’s normal when it obviously isn’t. I guess they don’t want to replace it. If it’s faulty they should pay the postage as it’s under guarantee. I don’t have another power supply to try it I’m afraid.
andyspencer
Registered
I've seen this fault on an older 1200Z all in one unit. It was intermittent, so didn't do it every time. I put it down to transit damage. You could also hear something loose inside rattling around. The unit was returned to the seller so I can't help on if the unit was repaired or not. I seem to recall the fault occurred regardless of if the layout was connected or not. My other Massoth system was quite happy to operate said layout, so I was happy nothing outside was causing the issue.
As muns mentioned above, the latest firmware is 2.65 and hasn't been updated for quite some time. If you purchased last year brand new, then it will almost certainly have this version installed. I've not heard anything official from Massoth mentioning this issue and needing to cycle the power on startup? Does it always work when cycling the power once or do you need to do it several times?
As muns mentioned above, the latest firmware is 2.65 and hasn't been updated for quite some time. If you purchased last year brand new, then it will almost certainly have this version installed. I've not heard anything official from Massoth mentioning this issue and needing to cycle the power on startup? Does it always work when cycling the power once or do you need to do it several times?
Thank you for your reply. Such things as firmware and computers have left me far behind I’m afraid. I do have a friend who is very knowledgeable about such things so I’d better ask him. The way it goes I turn it on with or without any track connected, the lights flash on downwards in order but they stop on the bottom red light. I switch off and back on fairly quickly and the system follows the same sequence, but finally the green light at the top is on.
Attachments
According to the central station the version of firmware is as you said, 2.65
Attachments
Loco
Registered
I have the same setup as you (Massoth 1210Z with a 24VDC 1210T power supply) which misbehaves similar to yours in one specific case, i.e. failing to boot stopping on the solid red light.
This only happens when the 1210Z is connected to a PC via the USB interface and the 1210Z is shut down after the PC software is closed. When this happens the 1210Z goes in to an emergency stop mode with the red light blinking, and the next time the 1210Z is started it stops during boot with the solid red light. It also recovers when restarted after this has happened, just like you have experienced. I do prefer to wait a few seconds when restarting though, allowing the unit to power down completely.
I also have a Massoth 800Z with a 16VAC Faller power supply, this unit never has this issue when the PC connection is used. This unit is not used as much as the 1210Z, as it is only used in my office for testing and is a backup for the 1210Z.
I have not tried to use the 1210T power supply with the 800Z to see if it is related to that power supply, the 800Z I have will accept both AC and DC power. The 1210Z on the other hand only accepts DC power, so I can't use the Faller power supply with that unit.
Both the 1210Z and the 800Z are running the latest firmware 2.65.
As you can see I haven't really spent any time trying to debug this issue as it only happens if I get the shutdown sequence of the 1210Z and the PC software (Rocrail) wrong, and the remedy is quite simple with a restart, yet a little annoying. Your case is far worse as you have to do it all the time and has to be a bug. My issue could of course be an undocmented feature of the 1210Z (and not the 800Z).
This only happens when the 1210Z is connected to a PC via the USB interface and the 1210Z is shut down after the PC software is closed. When this happens the 1210Z goes in to an emergency stop mode with the red light blinking, and the next time the 1210Z is started it stops during boot with the solid red light. It also recovers when restarted after this has happened, just like you have experienced. I do prefer to wait a few seconds when restarting though, allowing the unit to power down completely.
I also have a Massoth 800Z with a 16VAC Faller power supply, this unit never has this issue when the PC connection is used. This unit is not used as much as the 1210Z, as it is only used in my office for testing and is a backup for the 1210Z.
I have not tried to use the 1210T power supply with the 800Z to see if it is related to that power supply, the 800Z I have will accept both AC and DC power. The 1210Z on the other hand only accepts DC power, so I can't use the Faller power supply with that unit.
Both the 1210Z and the 800Z are running the latest firmware 2.65.
As you can see I haven't really spent any time trying to debug this issue as it only happens if I get the shutdown sequence of the 1210Z and the PC software (Rocrail) wrong, and the remedy is quite simple with a restart, yet a little annoying. Your case is far worse as you have to do it all the time and has to be a bug. My issue could of course be an undocmented feature of the 1210Z (and not the 800Z).
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LGB-Phil: Your statement: "If it’s faulty they should pay the postage as it’s under guarantee." What you or I think Massoth should or shouldn't do doesn't count, it's what their warranty specifies. The warranty statement in their DiMax 1210Z User Guide: "Valid warranty claims will be serviced without charge within the warranty period. For warranty service please return the product to your dealer or send it directly to the manufacturer. Return shipping charges are not covered by Massoth." So, it's the buyer's responsibility to take or ship it to the Massoth dealer or factory.
Based upon all the comments you've received from everyone, it appears the consensus is that your 1210Z is defective. Therefore, my suggestion to you is to fill out the Massoth Return Label (Return Material Authorization" card that came with your unit, including the description of the malfunction, and along with your payment receipt, either drop it off at your Massoth Dealer and tell them you want warranty service on it, and if they can't fix it, then they need to ship it to Massoth Germany. Alternatively, if you think they'll give you push-back, instead ship it directly to Massoth Germany for the warranty service. For an expensive piece of equipment like the 1210Z, I feel it's worth paying the shipping both ways if that will get your unit fixed or perhaps replaced with a new unit.
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