LGB reversing loop module 55081

[Zerogee]

I wasn't aware of the changeover, but I'd strongly suspect they have gone to the same design as Massoth's own one, which can work in two modes - either the old short-circuit method OR by the use of special sensor tracks that detect the loco entering the loop and switch the polarity without the short-circuit.
In any case, I'd strongly recommend buying Massoth's own version rather than the one they build for LGB, as they are usually cheaper!
Mark (Muns) has one in right now according to his website:
http://www.gardenrailoutlet.co.uk/massoth-dimax-reverse-loop-module < Link To http://www.gardenrailoutl...ax-reverse-loop-module


Jon

 

[Gizzy]

Not sure if the 50081 can exist with a 50080?

However, I have just the one 50080 on my layout and I'd be happy to swap it for the newer version 50081 to save you the costs of changing all your units if that is indeed the case....

 

[beavercreek]

I am making an 'autoreversing' dog bone double loop connected with a single line and have been delving deep into the pros and cons of the options available.I will be using the Massoth 8157001 (LGB 55081) modules
Nigel do you use one module per loop or are you using one module to control more than one loop?
It seems that the Massoth 8157001 and the new LGB variant have both 'short circuit' and 'non-short circuit sensor' modes.
But I am still not clear whether one module can control more than one loop in either mode. It makes sense that it will only see a short circuit, in another loop to the one that it is wired into, if in short circuit mode so the sensor option maybe only fine with one module per loop.

 

[beavercreek]

Hi Nigel
I have a thread/topic open on the MyLargeSacle forum on which the Massoth guy in USA has been posting his responses. In my last posting on the thread, I was asking the definitive answers to questions, one of which is the using one module for both or a module for each loop on my dogbone, double-loop, single connecting track, line. I have also sent a message to him as well asking the same questions. So far no reply to the questions. Perhaps he is testing the situation.
here is the link to the thread http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...f/23/aft/128079/afv/topic/afnp/300812/Default < Link To http://www.mylargescale.c...np/300812/Default

Some say that, if the Massoth 8157001 module is used in 'short circuit' mode, then it will act just like the LGB 55080 and there can be one module per loop. It is when in 'sensor' mode that there seems to be a problem.But some say it is the other way around.
So the verdict is out as to which is true. A few folk have had success with using the old LGB 55080 with one module per loop. But I have not heard from or seen anyone say how they have used the Massoth 8157001 module for this purpose.


The curved ball that I have also sent into the equation, is the use of the Massoth module for DC operation (as I have a lot of locos still 'unchipped', I wanted the option for using them on the looped line).
The problem with DC mode is the fact that the modules change the polarity to the connecting line not in the loops as in DCC mode let alone that the module needs its own power supply in that mode.
Cliff has sent me a diagram where he thinks that one module could be used to control two loops in DC mode but there would have to be extensive wiring between the loops.
The 'switching' for DC to DCC would be easier with one module (for both DC and DCC) but that is for another day as I just want to finally get the lowdown on the multiple loop/Massoth in DCC situation first.

Whatever the mode I would be only using one train on the double loop line at any one time.

 

[Cliff George]

I have been trying to find out whether it is really the case that triggering one RLM in short circuit mode automatically causes all the others to trigger as well.

Yes it does.

Normally it doesn't matter and no one ever notices. This is the only reason why two trains cannot be crossing a reversing loop boundary on two different reversers at the same time.

Consider this: Train trA crosses a reversing loop boundary revB, a short circuit occurs and the polarity is equalised allowing the train to cross the boundary revB. At the same time all of the other reversers detect the same short circuit and reverse but it make no difference since no other train is crossing a boundary.

Now Train trC is about to cross over a reversing loop boundary revD. It causes a short circuit and the reverser for revD reverses to allow trC into the loop. All of the other reversers detect the short circuit and reverse, including the reverser responsible for revB. Unfortunatley trA is still half way over the boundary revB when it does so. This causes an unrecoverable short circuit and everything stops.

If there were no short circuits then other reversers could not reverse when a train entered any loop and then it would be possible to have two trains (or more) crossing boundaries at the same time. Using the sensor mode eliminates the short circuits and thus eliminates this problem, with the single exception of two trains crossing the two boundaries of the same loop at the same time.

I have also looked into an alternative product - the [font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"]DCC Specialties - PSX-AR - Power Shield X Circuit Breaker and Auto Reverser[/font]
This product operates in short circuit mode, but is a bit more sophisticated than the LGB 55080.

Sorry don't know anything about this.

 

[Cliff George]

The Massoth manual for their 55081 equivalent seems to suggest that this is the case, as it says only one reversing loop can be used at the same time.

If a train is completly in a reversing loop and not crossing a boundary then it is OK for another train to enter a different reversing loop. Although the reversing loop with the train will detect the short and reverse, this make no difference to a DCC train. In this sence it is OK for more than one reversing loop to be used at a time. The problem is more than one train crossing a BOUNDARY at a time.

I have two reversing loops on my layout, both using the Massoth 8157001. Due the my automatic control system I can run many trains at the same time, and have to be careful about reversing loop restrictions. The reversing loops are defined as blocks, and the automatic system will allow only one train in a block at a time, thus solving one issue. But this wouldn't stop two trains each entering a different reversing loop at the same time. This is one of the reasons I use the 8157001 in sensor mode, because there is then no problem with the latter scenario. I don't have a problem with reversing loops under automatic control. More often I do have a problem when running manually as I forget the reversing loop restrictions!

 

[Railfan]

Mike, way to create a row on MLS between Kevin and Greg! Of course, those two are always at it. Great fun!

 

[Zerogee]

Mike, way to create a row on MLS between Kevin and Greg! Of course, those two are always at it. Great fun!

"This forum member is not sufficiently enraged yet, so I'm going to poke it with this stick....."

Jon.

 

[Railfan]

Mike, way to create a row on MLS between Kevin and Greg! Of course, those two are always at it. Great fun!

"This forum member is not sufficiently enraged yet, so I'm going to poke it with this stick....."

Jon.

YES! We can argue better than MLS!

 

[Cliff George]

Hello Nigel,

9 reversing loops, that must be some layout. Have you got any pictures you can post?

 

[trammayo]

I posted a slideshow on YouTube about 18 months ago, but things have progressed a bit since then. I do have some more recent photos, but I can't work out how to post them here. The image inserter only seems to want to accept a URL and I don't have a Web page to post anything to. Is there some trick to getting JPEG photos into these posts that I am missing?

If you click on the "Reply to message", the new window has a tool bar and there is "paper clip" icon next to the Smiley face.

Click on that "clip" and a further window opens. This allows you to upload pics.

There is a limit to pic size otherwise, if over 250kb they won't load up.

Some, depending on the forum section you are posting in, allow you to post up to ten pics. When you have selected your pic, upload.

Once the upload is successful (a window appears telling you), it will return to the message reply box and list them at the bottom of the box.

If you move your cursor in the reply to where you would like to position your pic(s), click on the list and it will embed it in the text. Keep doing this until all pics (by title or file name) are where you would like them and "post message".

Failure to add them in the text window will still allow the pics to upload but they will appear as thumbnails and it is rather tedious for prospective viewers to have to click on them to view.

All this presupposes you are using a PC or Laptop. If its a mobile, I haven't a clue!

 

[trammayo]

Maybe it's how your page is set I think there are two different modes (one for mobile phones?).

Maybe somebody else who uses things other than a PC to connect to the internet can advise? I'm not one for all-singing and dancing machine I like simple things!

I think you can set preferences and, if it's not obvious how to do it (it isn't to me), them just try searching for Posting Photos (or pictures?) or ask a question in the Help thread.

Good luck, and I look forward to seeing photos

Sorry I'm not much use in the IT department.

 

[trammayo]

Yes, looks a very interesting line

I just wonder why they are only showing up as thumbnails (unless you click on them) - even though they are in the text as well?

Also, you can have them bigger (up to 250Kb) if you want.