LGB 20232 0-4-0 Steam Locomotive with Sound

[LGB333]

I'm going to install a Massoth DC Analog pulsed smoker into this LGB 20232 sound steamer.......the customer operates the locomotive on DC power. The main board does have a DCC Interface for using a Massoth L decoder; the sound board also has a DCC Interface for a second L decoder. I assume the sound board in the tender produces its chuff sounds, electronically since there's no hall sensor/pulse generator in the locomotive or tender, so trying to figure out how to use the sound board's chuff sounds for the smoker isn't practical. So I need a pulse input to the Massoth smoker and I'm not going to install a hall sensore/pulse generator into the locomotive's motor block.......too much time and tedious effort.

The Massoth smoker's instructions indicate you can use any one of their Massoth driving/function decoders to provide the pulses to the smoker, so I think I'll try using the little M decoder, very small and cheap. The other option would be to use the main board's DCC Interface to insert an L decoder, connect the smoker to it, and then operate the locomotive still in DC analog power, but that's a more expensive option. The pulsed smoker operates on track power 7 - 24 volts DC. Has anyone tried installing a pulsed smoker into one of these little steamers?

 

[LGB333]

I set up the Massoth M Decoder with programming CV120 = 5 (Range 1 - 16). It all works but I'd have to test the locomotive with the sound tender attached so sync the decoder's pulse rate with the chuff sounds. But instead I've decided to use the Massoth L Decoder since the wiring connections are much easier.......you just push it into the locomotive's DCC Interface and then connect the smoker's power input wires with push-pin connectors added to the deocoder's track power terminals, and use the push-pin teminals for FA6 and Ground for the pulse input.

 

[PhilP]

Sometimes, it is better to spend the extra, for a known solution.

PhilP

 

[Greg Elmassian]

So, trying to understand what this is all about.

DC loco...

I have gleaned that you wanted an easier install.

So the decoder and smoke generator plugged into the loco "mother board"

M decoder, only for sound and to drive smoke generator, not connected to the motor.

So is the smoke puffing in time with the chuffs?

 

[LGB333]

So, trying to understand what this is all about.

DC loco...

I have gleaned that you wanted an easier install.

So the decoder and smoke generator plugged into the loco "mother board"

M decoder, only for sound and to drive smoke generator, not connected to the motor.

So is the smoke puffing in time with the chuffs?

Greg - I was going to post an update but will do so in my reply to you. I've decided to not use a Massoth L Driving/Function Decoder (or M decoder) connected to the locomotive to provide an effective simulated pulse signal the the DC pulse smoker. The Massoth smoker's installation instructions state, for clock simulation, use an L decoder's FA6 Terminal and Ground Terminal to provide the pulse input to the smoker. Then you can use the decoder's CV120, Time Base for the Sound Pulse Trigger Chuffs) to adjust the pulse rate in the Range 1 (Slow) to 16 (Fast). I couldn't get the pulses input to the smoker. But I now see that Terminal FA6 needs to be activated by adjusting CV13 (Function Outputs in Analog Mode).

But I've decided instead to install a clock sensor/pulse generator installed inside the locomotive's motor block (round magnet on the axle). This provides a more accurate pulse rate to the smoker than trying to get the decoder's clock simulation adjusted to the wheel revolutions, and then for the cuff sounds from the tender's sound board.. The smoker now works great using the clock sensor.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Yep, there are very few systems that can be adjusted to sync exactly. I've found one decoder that does it well, but most do not.

Getting a real "chuff trigger" on the loco (whether mechanical, hall effect or optical) is hard to beat if it is reliable.

Greg

 

[Paul M]

Yep, there are very few systems that can be adjusted to sync exactly. I've found one decoder that does it well, but most do not.

Getting a real "chuff trigger" on the loco (whether mechanical, hall effect or optical) is hard to beat if it is reliable.

Greg

Unless, of course, you go live steam

 

[PhilP]

Unless, of course, you go live steam

Would that be :

Direct Condensation Conversion?



PhilP.

 

[LGB333]

Here are a few photos of the Massoth DC Smoker installation into the LGB 20232 Sound Steamer. Quite a challenge mostly physical: Installing the clock generator into the motor block; used my ultrasonic cutter to remove the base holding the smoke stack inside the smoke box for fitment of the pulsed smoker. I used epoxy putty to seal the smoker's exhaust hole to the smoke box and then placed the putty on both top sides to hold the smoker in place. Finally sealed the smoke exhaust connection using epoxy glue over the putty to protect it from smoke fluid deterioration. Note: The last two photos are of another LGB 20232-series steamer's smoke box that I experimented with first to remove the smoke stack base with the ultrasonic cutting tool, and then used the same method on the customer's locomotive. These photos were made prior to my applying the epoxy glue to seal the epoxy putty.

 

[LGB333]

Here's a link to my YouTube Channel that has a short video of the final project operating on my DC Roller Wheels Test Stand. I set the pulse rate in the pulsed smoker's decoder to use 2 pulses instead of 4 pulses per wheel revolution.

Old Dominion Railways - LGB Trains YouTube Channel Video of Massoth Pulsed Smoker:

 

[Greg Elmassian]

it does not look like the "clock" input is working.... if you count sound chuffs, 1,2,3,4, over and over you will see that "4" slowly moves clockwise...

is the clock generator only on the smoker?

 

[LGB333]

it does not look like the "clock" input is working.... if you count sound chuffs, 1,2,3,4, over and over you will see that "4" slowly moves clockwise...

is the clock generator only on the smoker?

Greg, the clock generator is working properly to be in sync with the wheels revolutions. The problem is that the sound board is a separate function inside the tender and I'm not sure how it creates the chuff sounds, so it's not going to be totally in sync with the wheels and smoker. So, this is what you get, and albiet not perfect, it's as good as it gets for this type of basic DC sound configuration. I sent a text with the video to my customer and his reaction: "Hi Tom, that is fantastic and so awesome!" So as long as he's happy, I'm happy!

 

[Greg Elmassian]

OK, so the answer is that the "clock generator" is indeed only on the smoke unit... that matches what I see...

Yes, I'm real picky, most normal people would be very happy.

Greg

 

[LGB333]

OK, so the answer is that the "clock generator" is indeed only on the smoke unit... that matches what I see...

Yes, I'm real picky, most normal people would be very happy.

Greg

Greg, yes, I'm also basically a perfectionist similar to you probably. But some customers are only willing to spend a minimum amount of money for this hobby unlike you an me, money is no object! (Well, not totally).

I suspect that the sound board in the tender is producing the chuff rate from the track voltage, and LGB tried to originally snyc it with the locomotive's wheels revolutions. Since the new pulsed smoker is directly receiving the pulses from clock generator on the locomotive's turning wheels axle, the smoker and wheels revolutions are in sync. But the sound board's chuff rate error is now obvious by watching the smoke puffs rate. Overall, LGB designed a pretty good locomotive and sound tender back in 2003 when it was introduced in spite of it being made in China.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Yep, agree with everything you said...

If there was a complaint, "tuning" the sound unit to come closer to the chuff triggering rate would be an option...

Greg