Converting LGB 20892 from track power to battery/wireless control

[rgaps]

Hello again. This is Rick Gaps back looking for some assistance in converting an LGB 20892 (Sumpter Valley Mallet) from track power/control to wireless. I bought the locomotive about three years ago, and got some good help/info here at that time. But other things came up and was I not able to start the project until recently. For the conversion I purchased a Massoth XL decoder and adapter cable, a CVP systems AirWire900 CONVRTR-60 receiver, and CVP T5000 Wireless throttle. I was able to get everything wired up and the wireless throttle connects to the locomotive just fine. I can run it forward and backward, and vary the speed, but none of the 'extras' (sound and lights) are working. I don't know how to test the sound seperately, but I have tested the headlight and it works just fine. I contacted both Massoth (U.S.) and CVP, but they could not provide any useful assistance, or even guesses. I've been looking around on the web, but have been unsuccessful finding anything of use. The only suggestions I've gotten are 'take out all of the LGB electronics and start over from scratch.', which will by my last resort. So, anyone have any ideas. I'm all ears. Thanks.

Rick Gaps

 

[PhilP]

Hi Rik,

I assume you are aware the XL decoder is not a sound decoder?

Did the loco have sound before you started?

Can you post some photos of the installation?

PhilP

 

[rgaps]

Hi Rik,

I assume you are aware the XL decoder is not a sound decoder?

Did the loco have sound before you started?

Can you post some photos of the installation?

PhilP

Yes, I am aware to that fact. The locomotive has sound, which is one of the reasons I used the Massoth decoder. I had read somewhere that the sound in that version was very good. I'll get a photo together later.

 

[rgaps]

Yes, I am aware to that fact. The locomotive has sound, which is one of the reasons I used the Massoth decoder. I had read somewhere that the sound in that version was very good. I'll get a photo together later.

Here's a picture of the installation. Please excuse the lack of heat-shrink on the wire solder joints. This is only for testing.

 

[dunnyrail]

Ok I could be on the wrong track here but…..
Looking at your setup have you fed the Motors on the bogie direct from the XL with those yellow and green wires? If you have then you are not feeding via the LGB on board sound board.

What I think you need to do is take the 4 wires from each bogie, the track feeds go to your XL and the power from the XL go to the out wires from the LGB board to the bogie. Finding how to do that second process in the LGB chip could be a bit tricky and so easy to get the motors going in opposite directions. Oh and yes make sure you do get the track connections from both bogies right but I think you may already have achieved that.

 

[PhilP]

Good spot, Jon..

The connectors from the motor blocks would still plug onto the original board. Four wires for track and motor from the XL would plug to the pins on the original board, and the set of DIP switches would need to be off/open.

PhilP

 

[Ralphmp]

Here’s a couple of photos of how I did myMallet, keeping the original LGB onboard sound. As Jon and Phil have pointed out, motor feed to decoder comes from the LGB board and dip switches are off. Hope it helps.

 

[dunnyrail]

Ooops yes sorry forgot about the dips needing to be off.

 

[rgaps]

Okay, I seen now (said the blind man). It appears that I misinterpreted the wiring diagram. So now it's back to square one. Thanks all for the assistance.

 

[rgaps]

Okay, based on all of your feedback, I rewired the decoder installation, and now when I turn on the power I hear the standing steam locomotive sounds. When I start up it gives two toots on the whistle, and chuffs along with the action of the cylinders. And the lights work too. But I am not able to get a bell to ring. That's a small thing, I guess, but I would still like it to work. After reading many other posts on LGB modifications it appears that I might be the only person brave enough (foolish enough?) to do this, retaining the original LGB electronics, and converting to wireless dead-rail operation. So, if anyone has an idea about getting the bell to ring I would appreciate your suggestions. I will be out of town for a few days, so I may not get a chance to test any ideas, or provide feedback. Thanks again for the help.

Rick

 

[dunnyrail]

My dead rail conversions have been either DCC or using My Loco Sound with the appropriate TX supplies by Fosworks. I did do a Sound Sumpter with on board analogue sound by LGB, no way I found to trigger bells or whistles except via the track mounted activator option. Not even sure that this dis the bell either but may be worth experimenting. You need to try the track activator (17050) mounted either way to trigger sounds. They are not a big investment and you may have a couple lurking as they tendEd to give a couple with on board sound locomotives.

 

[Ralphmp]

Okay, based on all of your feedback, I rewired the decoder installation, and now when I turn on the power I hear the standing steam locomotive sounds. When I start up it gives two toots on the whistle, and chuffs along with the action of the cylinders. And the lights work too. But I am not able to get a bell to ring. That's a small thing, I guess, but I would still like it to work. After reading many other posts on LGB modifications it appears that I might be the only person brave enough (foolish enough?) to do this, retaining the original LGB electronics, and converting to wireless dead-rail operation. So, if anyone has an idea about getting the bell to ring I would appreciate your suggestions. I will be out of town for a few days, so I may not get a chance to test any ideas, or provide feedback. Thanks again for the help.

Rick

This may help -

Post in thread 'Installing a Mossoth eMotion XL in an LGB 23851 with decoder interface.'
Installing a Mossoth eMotion XL in an LGB 23851 with decoder interface.

It describes how to operate whistle and bell on the LGB fitted sound board after an XL conversion. If you go to the DCC forum and search in that forum for Mallet you should find several entries where folk have done a DCC conversion whilst retaining the original onboard sound.

 

[PhilP]

You only have to ask..

Violet and brown wires, to bell and whistle triggers on LGB analogue sound board.

Small board at the bottom of the picture is a dual FET switch. This is connected to two outputs on the receiver, and triggers the sounds.

PhilP

 

[rgaps]

This may help -

Post in thread 'Installing a Mossoth eMotion XL in an LGB 23851 with decoder interface.'
Installing a Mossoth eMotion XL in an LGB 23851 with decoder interface.

It describes how to operate whistle and bell on the LGB fitted sound board after an XL conversion. If you go to the DCC forum and search in that forum for Mallet you should find several entries where folk have done a DCC conversion whilst retaining the original onboard sound.

Okay, I looked at the info in you above link, and, of course, have some questions.
1. You have two of the relays installed. I assume that one is for the bell, and the other is for the whistle(?).
2. For the second relay, where would the connections go on the decoder, and what CV changes are necessary?
3. In the diagram for the relay you indicated CV112 set to 15 for nearly half of track voltage (24v). But my battery only supplies 14.4 volts. Should I use a higher value for CV112?
4. Do I sound as confused as I feel?

thanks

Rick Gaps

 

[dunnyrail]

Aha realisation comes to play for me (I think).

What the relays are doing is to replace the burst of power that the reed switch gives to the onboard sound board when it goes across a track magnet. If I understand correct.

1 Find where wires from reed switches go to the chip.

2 couple these via each relay.

3 work out how to activate each relay from the DCC Chip.

Is that right?