Cheapskate alert - Point conversion?

[Eaglecliff]

Cheapskate Alert!!!

Is it possible/practicable/worthwhile to convert an LGB R1 point to R3? If so, how? (I wouldn't have a problem using timber sleepers.)

 

[nicebutdim]

It'd be far easier to just completely fabricate your own. The frog will be a too tight angle and you'll have to make longer check rails. Other than that you'll need longer rails for the stock rails and the blades will need lengthening/pivoting. Doable but a PITA to be honest.

 

[ntpntpntp]

Really is no benefit at all in attempting it. The whole geometry and physical rail length etc. is entirely different. Easier to simply make your own point from scratch as has been suggested.

 

[Eaglecliff]

I feared the answers might be along those lines (groan) but thought it might be worth asking the question. Thanks, chaps.

 

[GAP]

A couple of plans that may help with building one.

 

[dunnyrail]

A couple of plans that may help with building one.

Back in the 80's I was building my own track for my Garden line. Turned out to be a complete pain in the butt as I had been using Bonds 7's like Brass Spikes to hold the rail down into wooden sleepers. Problem was that the dampness and expansion plus contraction of the sleepers kept pushing the pins up. Needed to go over the line pretty well every time I had a running session to push them back down again. A real pain with over 150ft of line including Dual 45/32 Points etc. i did a sort of temporary fix on some of the worst bits by using Steel Pins, but they of course over time rust.

So I bit the bullet and went down the Peco route for track and have never looked back since. I did luck out at the time as my Boss had a Peco Account and sold me all my Track at Trade Price. I now use a mix of Peco, Trainline, LGB and Aristo on my new line. Worth while hunting out second hand track if you can get it. Points can be a great saving. Glendale and GRS frequently have track in from broken down collections, but you are a good way off from both of them at Derby.
JonD

 

[Rhinochugger]

There was a guy at Peterborough a couple of years ago with hand made track and points - his methof of spikes in wooden sleepers was to put brass pins in from the underside, and to cut them off with end cutters over the bottom flange of the rail - which gave a good resemblance to rail spikes

 

[stockers]

He seems to be at many expos Mike and he has shown me that method too - looks good and I expect it works well.

3.0.1 Models, I think. A one man business and I don't think he bothers much with the internet.

 

[PhilP]

Probably too busy cuttin' rail spikes!!

 

[dunnyrail]

There was a guy at Peterborough a couple of years ago with hand made track and points - his methof of spikes in wooden sleepers was to put brass pins in from the underside, and to cut them off with end cutters over the bottom flange of the rail - which gave a good resemblance to rail spikes

That would certainly solve the problems that I had. Another option would be to hold rail in place, drill a hole through the sleeper both sides of the rail and push a U from undneath bending over rail to look like Spikes. Bit of a faf but would work and you could use old Mains Copper Wire to make the U's perhaps holding in place with a bit of solder. Initial work to get some Rail in place held would be to put U's in over the top say every 4th or 5th Sleeper, drill the rst turn over do the underneath U's then redo the temporary ones. Track building is not for the faint hearted, takes time and effort but is certainly worthwhile for the savings to be made with points.
JonD

 

[GAP]

Back in the 80's I was building my own track for my Garden line. Turned out to be a complete pain in the butt as I had been using Bonds 7's like Brass Spikes to hold the rail down into wooden sleepers. Problem was that the dampness and expansion plus contraction of the sleepers kept pushing the pins up. Needed to go over the line pretty well every time I had a running session to push them back down again. A real pain with over 150ft of line including Dual 45/32 Points etc. i did a sort of temporary fix on some of the worst bits by using Steel Pins, but they of course over time rust.

So I bit the bullet and went down the Peco route for track and have never looked back since. I did luck out at the time as my Boss had a Peco Account and sold me all my Track at Trade Price. I now use a mix of Peco, Trainline, LGB and Aristo on my new line. Worth while hunting out second hand track if you can get it. Points can be a great saving. Glendale and GRS frequently have track in from broken down collections, but you are a good way off from both of them at Derby.
JonD

I'm going to try screwing a point to a piece of waterproof ply using brass pan head screws over the web of the rail then burying it in ballast, I'll just grind the screw head down a bit so its is not noticeable. The plans are my template or if I can get to a photocopier using that method both work for me.
My accountant ("Do it on a shoe string or it doesn't happen" Pty Ltd) would have a heart attack if I suggested using tailor made points, I have to stick to roll my own for the next layout, plus the postage from the other side of the planet would be more than the things are worth.

 

[stockers]

I'll give the ply about 8 months!

 

[Gizzy]

Cheapskate Alert!!!

Is it possible/practicable/worthwhile to convert an LGB R1 point to R3? If so, how? (I wouldn't have a problem using timber sleepers.)

I suggest you trade in your R1s for R3s. You should get 1 R3 for the cost of 2 x R1 points....

 

[dunnyrail]

I'll give the ply about 8 months!

With a lot of luck!
JonD

 

[dunnyrail]

I'm going to try screwing a point to a piece of waterproof ply using brass pan head screws over the web of the rail then burying it in ballast, I'll just grind the screw head down a bit so its is not noticeable. The plans are my template or if I can get to a photocopier using that method both work for me.
My accountant ("Do it on a shoe string or it doesn't happen" Pty Ltd) would have a heart attack if I suggested using tailor made points, I have to stick to roll my own for the next layout, plus the postage from the other side of the planet would be more than the things are worth.

Look at what that guy with the Tramway is doing with Ally Rail (link below) may be an option and he is doing it on good wood. Not ply. Stay away from ply outside, even the marine stuff is an issue. Specially if burried in ballast or earth.

https://www.gscalecentral.net/threads/eltham-south-electric-tramway.307019/

JonD

 

[GAP]

Look at what that guy with the Tramway is doing with Ally Rail (link below) may be an option and he is doing it on good wood. Not ply. Stay away from ply outside, even the marine stuff is an issue. Specially if burried in ballast or earth.

https://www.gscalecentral.net/threads/eltham-south-electric-tramway.307019/

JonD

The ply I will be using is called "Form Ply" it has a type of laminate on each side that is waterproof and the ply has better water resistance than marine ply, its main purpose is for constructing form work for concrete, I've seen it used on numerous jobs and it is just left in the builders yard out in the weather between jobs.I'll just seal the cut end with waterproofing compound. The biggest pain of it is the laminate wrecks saw blade fairly quickly.
Because my next layout is going to be raised I am considering using the ply for my decking.
It will not be in a moist environment all the time and Ill be using a shaped ballast bed that lets water drain away probably glued with marine grade silicone.
I have used ply on my current layout sitting on crushed terracotta tile and it lasted 2 years all I did was soak it in old sump oil.

 

[Melbournesparks]

I'm going to try screwing a point to a piece of waterproof ply using brass pan head screws over the web of the rail then burying it in ballast, I'll just grind the screw head down a bit so its is not noticeable. The plans are my template or if I can get to a photocopier using that method both work for me.
My accountant ("Do it on a shoe string or it doesn't happen" Pty Ltd) would have a heart attack if I suggested using tailor made points, I have to stick to roll my own for the next layout, plus the postage from the other side of the planet would be more than the things are worth.

You certainly have to be made of money to afford commercially manufactured points here, it's just too expensive to be justified.

Look at what that guy with the Tramway is doing with Ally Rail (link below) may be an option and he is doing it on good wood. Not ply. Stay away from ply outside, even the marine stuff is an issue. Specially if burried in ballast or earth.

https://www.gscalecentral.net/threads/eltham-south-electric-tramway.307019/

JonD

I used a bit of treated pine for that (sometimes called permapine, the green stuff) which lasts for years buried in the ground. I'd hazard a guess the Australian climate might be a bit kinder to buried timber than in the UK.

If cost is your ultimate consideration, it's hard to beat aluminium bar. If you can afford to shell out for some brass rail though (or can scavenge some) it's much easier and quicker to construct points with. There's about the same amount of cutting, but since you can solder or spike the rail down there's no need to drill and rivet the brackets.

I'm making another set of points at the moment with more conventional brass construction, mostly using rail from old R1 curves. Eventually it will be buried in concrete up to rail level like proper tram track.

 

[Jon Medlin]

I have made 8 X 5 foot radius points and the good thing about making your own points one can have what ever radius one wants

 

[Eaglecliff]

I suggest you trade in your R1s for R3s. You should get 1 R3 for the cost of 2 x R1 points....

Yes, that's what I usually do with Tony the Sparesman, but he's currently out of stock, unless he's acquired any at Peterborough this weekend. Glendale aren't advertising any secondhand ones at the moment.

 

[dunnyrail]

Yes, that's what I usually do with Tony the Sparesman, but he's currently out of stock, unless he's acquired any at Peterborough this weekend. Glendale aren't advertising any secondhand ones at the moment.

Hm sure I saw some R3's at Peterborough. I was not there early so would probably have been around 1230 or 1400 ish when I saw them. There was also some long straights under a board on one of the Traders Stands. Alan must have missed those! Perhaps he is too tall to have noticed them, little guys like me have no problems with seeing boxes under tables.
JonD