Ballasting For Effect

[Don Gilham]

I've read through most (at least I hope iit's most) of the threads on tracklaying, and very informative too !

However, my interest in ballasting is purely cosmetic, because the PECO G45 track is (going to be) elevated and nailed down, so please may I ask for suggetions on ballast for cosmetic purposes ? The layout is outdoors 100% of the time - I have heard that mixing the ballast (whatever it be) with quick-drying cement is a good idea to fix it in place ?

Gawd, lots of questions, hopefully not too inane

 

[ge_rik]

I have heard that mixing the ballast (whatever it be) with quick-drying cement is a good idea to fix it in place ?
Gawd, lots of questions, hopefully not too inane

Don
Not at all inane but, as you have no doubt already found out, this topic is as controversial as global warming! There will be as many answers as there are garden railway modellers.

My ten pen'orth is that I use a combination of grit, sand and cement mixed and brushed on dry , then a sprinkling of water from a watering-can, then some watered-down PVA to which has been added a drop of washing-up liquid to break down the surface tension. It's similar to the method I use on my indoor 00 layout. It maybe looks a but too dense for neatly ballasted track but is OK for the sorts of ballast used on early NG railways such as the Southwold.

eg

I've tried gravel with PVA, and also cement and grit without PVA but find the combined method to be the more effective.

See:
http://riksrailway.blogspot.com/2006/04/how-did-i-ballast-track.html

But as indicated above - there are bound to be other methods each with their own advocates.


Rik

 

[Neil Robinson]

You state that the ballast will be purely cosmetic, therefore I assume that you will be using fairly small grit to look right.
This stuff seems to be attractive to wildlife so whatever you choose to use you'd be wise to fix it in place with cement, PVA or some other adhesive.

 

[trammayo]

... and my 11 cents (= 10p) is that I use Westland horticultural grit. Nice size but needs retaining physically or glueing as suggested above. If you don't, a heavy deluge will wash it away or spread it about.

 

[Don Gilham]

Cactus grit

Well actually decorative stone in about 2 - 4 mm size - looks the part.

Thanks guys

Ballast applied dry, then PVA dilution used as per norm, but with weatherproof PVA - but one question, please. What's the best ratio of PVA to water for outdoor use ?

 

[Gizzy]

What's the best ratio of PVA to water for outdoor use ?

I'd go for 50/50....

 

[ge_rik]

What's the best ratio of PVA to water for outdoor use ?

I'd go for 50/50....

Sounds about right - I mix it until it's the consistency of single / pouring cream. Thin enough to flow easily.

Rik

 

[Don Gilham]

Thanks

 

[beavercreek]

Hi Don

As my layout is not elevated I have used a variety of grits depending on where in the garden the layout passes and what rocks it has to match etc (a little extreme but it has to blend in mostly!). In one area, the Quarry, the layout actually runs along the top pf a retaining wall. As the quarry is a slate Quarry I use slate scree as ballast as it is very small (3mm-5mm or so)...the problem, as has been said already, is that, on the wall section, there is some loss due to rain and bird attack. I cannot glue/cement it down as I am aware that the decorative top of the wall would be very hard to return to its pristine appearance should the track be removed. To this end I just top up the ballast every year. If another method is suggested that works then I will happily jump at it!

PS I am always on the look-out for different couloured small size grit. You called yours Cactus grit...what brand is it and what chain or nursery did you get it from?

 

[Don Gilham]

Hi Mr Beavercreek

I bought the grit from Bressingham, it's in small bags (unfortunately), I did ask if they did bigger ones but no - the only thing that the bag says is "pug", I've had a quick google but couldn't find anything. I'll snap a pikkie of the buffer stop later on and post it.

 

[muns]

I use "Border stone 5mm Alpine Cambrian Green" for my ballast and I have just started mixing it with cement to stop it wahing away.....only time will tell.

 

[Don Gilham]

Here's a pikkie of the buffer stop - the PVA mix I used was 70 water/30 PVA, before I read the advisories on 50/50 - doh ! But at least you can see what the "ballast" will look like.

 

[jameshilton]

I've used Horticultural grit from the garden centre - three big bags for a tenner. I have used this as it's sharp edged and small (about average 5mm) and has locked the track down nicely without the need (yet) of any further retaining screws or the like. Time will tell if I have any heave but as I laid the line on the foundation of an old patio I have a feeling it will be ok. In the heavy rain in June we saw some movement of the ballast shoulder on the embankment but this is quite easily topped up and has left a very realistic effect on the slope with a cascade of older ballast. I think the idea of regular track maintenance is quite appealing, and the ability to correct minor undulations by tamping the 'loose' track part of running a real railway.

 

[beavercreek]

Thanks for the piccies Don
I recognise that ballast and have used it in my 'Arrowhead' area. It is also marketed as plain horticultural grit by other producers. I have bought various shades of this including buff, grey, pink, and a grey-green. It is good sized for realistic use although not as good as what the American call 'fines' which is almost a dust with some very small grit amongst it. This would almost definitely, in our climate, wash away without being mixed with cement.
I have used larger sized grit/chippings 5-10mm on some parts of the layout where I made it slightly raised (15 - 20cm high) between two logroll retaining walls. I used the larger stuff there as it came in larger bags, filled space quicker and was mightily cheaper than the smaller grit bags.
I have since started to put the smaller gauge grit over the larger stuff for more realism and it has 'washed through' the larger gravel to a certain extent but seems to have stabilised now....time will tell

 

[garrymartin]

If the track is in an elevated position then it needs to be stuck down as the ballast will wash away. Mixing with dry cement will not work, you need to use the PVA method or sand, cement, ballast ,water mix, depending what you are adhering it to.

 

[KeithT]

I use horticultural grit. Initially I bought over 1/4 ton and laid it around the 40m of double track which is on decking boards. The problem is that it disappears! Partially washed away by heavy rain and partially removed by birds and so needs regular topping up.
It does have the advantage as James commented earlier of locking the track in place and where necessary it can be repacked easily to level the track.
The small size, 2-4mm, means it is 'sort of' scale but not too dusty to wash away easily.

 

[Don Gilham]

I've just checked, and after a good bout of sun my 70/30 mix seems to have done the trick - nice and solid. Have to see what a dose of rain does later

 

[garrymartin]

Aye it's the rain thats the devil. Water is one of the most destructive forces of nature, it will was 1 to 1 ballast out of a real railway.

 

[tramcar trev]

I did some experimenting and for my tramway where open ballasted track will be I'm going to use aquarium gravel which is really very coarse sand 2-3mm. Its also quite sharp and comes in a colour that looks like real blue metal ballast, i.e. a steely grey. Various stabilising agents were tested and the simplest though not the least expensive at this stage appears to be a product used to bond new cement render to old render called "Bond Crete' its PVA based and is suited to external use also it is flexible and will resist the attack of frost.... Applied via a watering can over dry ballast swept into position....

 

[Gizzy]

Here's a pikkie of the buffer stop - the PVA mix I used was 70 water/30 PVA, before I read the advisories on 50/50 - doh ! But at least you can see what the "ballast" will look like.

If the 70/30 mix works for you then stick (pardon the pun) with it Don. It'll use a lot less PVA for starters.

The Peco buffer looks great on your test track; I have some on my indoor layout Hardyard. They were outside but I didn't find them robust enough for garden use, so they were 'relocated'. Nice small footprint and they take up less room than an LGB buffer, essential when you only have 4 1/2 ft of scenic area....