Bachmann Trolley ?

Madman

Madman

Registered
25 Oct 2009
13,079
178
Pennsylvania, USA
All mine were from NW2's likewise.
Somewhere on this forum I did a few notes on fitting them. Probably a few years ago.
Just clear off all the rubbish on the underside of the tram & glue the NW2 unit in its place.
View attachment 252959

Does fitting the USA motor block alter the height of the trolley ?
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
Does fitting the USA motor block alter the height of the trolley ?
That depends how you do it..

If you 'just plonk the body on top', then yes, a little (higher, from memory)..
But not difficult to get it acceptable. - Even I have done it once. Must have turned-out OK, as I was offered good money for it. - A Christmas version, with a festoon of coloured lights, and a 'bargain' LGB Christmas music sound box.

I was going to do a second one, but then found that Bachmann Europe had the motors available at that time, so it never happened..
 
Madman

Madman

Registered
25 Oct 2009
13,079
178
Pennsylvania, USA
That depends how you do it..

If you 'just plonk the body on top', then yes, a little (higher, from memory)..
But not difficult to get it acceptable. - Even I have done it once. Must have turned-out OK, as I was offered good money for it. - A Christmas version, with a festoon of coloured lights, and a 'bargain' LGB Christmas music sound box.

I was going to do a second one, but then found that Bachmann Europe had the motors available at that time, so it never happened..

So did you have to do any surgery to the motor block or trolley to get it to sit at the proper height ?
 
Madman

Madman

Registered
25 Oct 2009
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178
Pennsylvania, USA
In looking at the USA Trains motor block, I see the wheels are 1 1/8" or alittle over 28 mm. I believe the Bachmann wheels on their trolleys are at least 31 MM or possibly a bit larger. I'm too lazy to go and measure them.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
USA Trains, NW2 block: 28mm dia. 84mm centres.

Bachmann, 37mm dia. 87mm centres.

You would need to cut the 'axle extensions' off the USA-T block. This block is the same width, but a lot thicker. - 27mm(B) to 39mm(USA). Top of block to axle centre-line is 15mm(B), 25mm(USA).

The Bachmann block has contact strips on the top, and there are 'fingers' to connect to these on the bottom of the tram. - There are also 'spacers' these fingers are screwed to. Removing these gives you 6-7mm more height for the taller USA-T block.
The side-frames fit to the Bachmann block in four holes (in the side) they are just sprung in. - I drilled holes in the USA-T block, so fitted in same way.

Couple of not very good photo's:
Unmodified tram sitting on USA-T block (no side-frames) height (ignoring end of ruler, so more than this!) to underside of tram: 45mm.

253211

Original Bachmann block: 40mm

253212

Trust me.. The angles are wrong, so the dimensions look wrong on the photo's. - Remember I am just quoting the number, there is that extra bit on the ruler..

So by taking the spacer-bits off the bottom of the tram (you have to sort the wiring anyway) it comes out about right.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
The blocks, side-by-side..

253215
 
Madman

Madman

Registered
25 Oct 2009
13,079
178
Pennsylvania, USA
The blocks, side-by-side..

View attachment 253215
Thanks again Phil. I wonder if I can impose on you a bit further. Would you take a picture of the trolley with the USA motor block installed along with the Bachmann side frames ?
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
Yes, sorry.. Had cleared the decks to prepare a spot of lunch. - You can tell SW is at work! ;)

Original Bachmann:
253221

USA Trains block, no modifications, so everything is a stressed:
253226

Next two shots are underside of Bachmann block with frames, and the same with the USA Trains block:
253223

See how the frames are pushed-out, as no holes for the 'pins' (moulded into the frame plastic). - I have tried to get the heights of the block and frame top (below) to match how they would be on the body, with no modifications:
253224

Finally, a shot to show the 'daylight' above the USA Trains block.. You can just make-out the wiring and pillar which needs moving:
253225
 

Attachments

dutchelm

dutchelm

Registered
24 Oct 2009
2,621
13
N Somerset
There is something wrong somewhere as you should not see the axles.
On the left is the original Bachmann, on the right the USA motor.
Note the bumpers are level & no axles show
Tram 1 (Medium).jpgtram 3 _Medium_.jpgtram 2 _Medium_.jpg
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
There is something wrong somewhere as you should not see the axles.
Dan was asking.. And I was saying..
This is an unmodified tram.. Dan asked for dimensions, and how it looked. I did say it needed work... :)

This is not the one I modified. - Bachmann Europe came-up with a replacement Bachmann motor, for this one.
 
P

Paradise

Registered
28 Jan 2010
668
66
On the left is the original Bachmann, on the right the USA motor.
Note the bumpers are level & no axles show
Yeah but one elf may be fatter than the other. :D
 
Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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8 Mar 2014
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San Diego
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A word of advice, the USAT motor blocks are not designed to take the weight of the train through the motor block.

the weight of the loco is transmitted through the chassis, to the sideframes, and from the bearings in the sideframes to the tips of the axle, the motor block sort of floats freely.

This is even more important to respect in the case of the NW-2 motor blocks, as most USAT axles have a brass bushing/bearing on the axle to the motor block, but I'm pretty sure the NW-2 axles ride directly in the plastic motor block, no bearings to speak of.

Clearly being a trolley, much less weight and most certainly not pulling a train, but keep those locations lubricated on a regular basis.

Greg
 
Madman

Madman

Registered
25 Oct 2009
13,079
178
Pennsylvania, USA
Thanks Mike & Phil. Looks like Mike has a point. Apparently the USA motor block can go far enough up that the axles are lined up, vertically, with the journals.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
the weight of the loco is transmitted through the chassis, to the sideframes, and from the bearings in the sideframes to the tips of the axle, the motor block sort of floats freely.
So it would be a 'better' solution to drill the frames, and fit bearings. - Rather than trim the axles.
Then beef-up the frame to block fixings, or fabricate some brackets. - To use the USA Trains fixing screws on the end of the block.

Thanks Greg.
 
dutchelm

dutchelm

Registered
24 Oct 2009
2,621
13
N Somerset
A word of advice, the USAT motor blocks are not designed to take the weight of the train through the motor block.

the weight of the loco is transmitted through the chassis, to the sideframes, and from the bearings in the sideframes to the tips of the axle, the motor block sort of floats freely.

This is even more important to respect in the case of the NW-2 motor blocks, as most USAT axles have a brass bushing/bearing on the axle to the motor block, but I'm pretty sure the NW-2 axles ride directly in the plastic motor block, no bearings to speak of.

Clearly being a trolley, much less weight and most certainly not pulling a train, but keep those locations lubricated on a regular basis.

Greg
I take your point Greg but the Bachmann tram is so light there should be no problem. I have had these modified trams running at shows continuously all day without problems. I would not even bother to use a Bachmann tram with its original equipment as they are not reliable enough for shows.
However the LGB trams just keep going on & on & are my first choice. Its just unfortunate that the Peter Witt & Aristo trams are the wrong scale.
 
PhilP

PhilP

G Scale, 7/8th's, Electronics
5 Jun 2013
23,470
488
Tamworth, Staffs.
Dependent on the plastics used, I doubt it will be a big problem? - Most LGB loco's, the axles run directly on the plastics of the block. - Though the Luran (? think that is the trade-name of the plastics) is pretty tough stuff.

But as Greg says, a little lubricate will help.
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
25,250
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North West Norfolk
I use thixotropic sauce on my french fries.... Heinz finally recognized a squeeze bottle was better for thixotropic liquids than a bottle with a narrowing top part, exactly backwards!

Greg
Shake oh shake the ketchup bottle
none will come and then the lott'll

:nerd::nerd::nerd::nerd:
 
Greg Elmassian

Greg Elmassian

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8 Mar 2014
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San Diego
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Phil: in a perfect world, putting bushings in the side frames and not modifying the motor block at all would be ideal, also lubrication easier.

Mike: I do indeed comment on the lesser "strain", but lube the axles all the same once in a while, they basically "floated" before.

Phil (again): the motor blocks seem to be some fiber-reinforced plastic, nothing as good as LGB Luran, agreed.

Rhino: :rofl:
 
S

Sstitham

Registered
24 Jul 2019
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0
56
Californja
The early one's are in a maroon box and are dreadful. I gave up on mine and replaced it with a usa trains motor block which runs great.
The later versions are in a red box and are much better and run smoothly. :)
I just replaced my motorblock with a USAT two axle block, connecting the jumpers for direct power. Problem is on my point to point with the Aristocraft reverse unit, it sails over the gap past the diode without the reverse unit noticing, then hits the Humber and spins its wheels. All my other locos work in it, just not this one. Any problems like that?
 
Alpineandy

Alpineandy

Registered
25 Oct 2009
1,624
15
Alpennines
I just replaced my motorblock with a USAT two axle block, connecting the jumpers for direct power. Problem is on my point to point with the Aristocraft reverse unit, it sails over the gap past the diode without the reverse unit noticing, then hits the Humber and spins its wheels. All my other locos work in it, just not this one. Any problems like that?
That's odd as I am running exactly the same setup with my tram and aristo reverse unit and it works fine. Try changing the jumpers around, it may work ?