Aster v Accucraft Climax - Pros & Cons?

[David Price]

Interested in feedback from owners of either or both versions of Live Steam Climax locomotives.

Putting aside the differences in scale (1:23 v 1:20.3) and the fact that the Aster is a 3-truck and the Accucraft a two-truck I would like comments on the pros and cons of each/both.

Youtube videos I've seen suggest that the Aster seems to run much faster than it prototypically should (like the early Aster Shay?) and the Accucraft seems to run at a more sensible speed (or perhaps that 's just the way the respective owners are running them?)

I'm particularly interested in any radio control conversions owners have done - most clips seem to just be running on nice smooth level tracks whereas some I visit can require mid-gear or reverse on the downgrade to control the train (and I have seen several posts which clarify that just because it is a geared locomotive does not mean it does not pickup speed on such lines).

The Aster appears to have more space in the rear unit for RC than would be available on the Accucraft.

 

[maxi-model]

Couple of things. With a live steamer you are usually looking for space in or under the cab for servos and/or placement of batteries and RX. This minimises need for complicated and flexible linkages to servos. The bunker area on the Accucraft Climax is really intended as a water reservoir 1) To provide extra water capacity that can be pumped directly to the boiler, hence the pump in there. Geared loco cylinders generally reciprocate more and at a faster rate than a rodded loco's (v distance) i.e. they can use up water fast. 2) The bunker water is usually added warm to raise gas pressure a bit too when operating and help make sure you are feeding gas not fluid to the burner. Handy on a cold day in Tundra like conditions.

If you do not intend to feed water from the bunker or keep the gas tank warmed, thereby making it habitable for batteries and RX, then you can remove the installed water pump to create extra space. But how much space does an RX and 2 - 4 AAA cells need ? You could put a servo in there too to actuate the reverser, drilling the tank (!), but a regulator linked one might be a bit complex from there. As Accucraft tend to use piston valves it might be possible to operate using just the reverser to control speed and direction. This will simplify RC install a lot.

Speed accusation could apply to the Accucraft Climax too. I mine has shown its ability to lift its skirts an run However, I think this might be the product of the longer throw of the pistons, compared to a Shay, and rods connecting to the drive shaft. The Climax looks more like a rodded loco in that respect (Ivatt Crab anyone ?). However, the Accucraft model is perfectly controllable at low speeds, but open up the regulator and watch it go. Gets over a others whining about "slow" geared locos making them follow at an unprototypically slow speed with their rodded locos. Inconsiderate speed freaks ! Max

 

[Charles M]

I have commissioned both the Aster Climax and the Accucraft Unit. The Aster unit has the feedwater pump run off of the drive shaft and to keep the water level up it has to be run faster that scale speed.
The Accucraft Climax that I had commissioned had to have all of the clearances on the gear train reset. They wear either too tight of too loose and made for a very poor running engine. This is worth checking if you are planning on buying one. Once the clearances are set though they will run very nicely and slower than the Aster model.
Charles M

 

[David Price]

Couple of things. With a live steamer you are usually looking for space in or under the cab for servos and/or placement of batteries and RX. This minimises need for complicated and flexible linkages to servos. The bunker area on the Accucraft Climax is really intended as a water reservoir 1) To provide extra water capacity that can be pumped directly to the boiler, hence the pump in there. Geared loco cylinders generally reciprocate more and at a faster rate than a rodded loco's (v distance) i.e. they can use up water fast. 2) The bunker water is usually added warm to raise gas pressure a bit too when operating and help make sure you are feeding gas not fluid to the burner. Handy on a cold day in Tundra like conditions.

If you do not intend to feed water from the bunker or keep the gas tank warmed, thereby making it habitable for batteries and RX, then you can remove the installed water pump to create extra space. But how much space does an RX and 2 - 4 AAA cells need ? You could put a servo in there too to actuate the reverser, drilling the tank (!), but a regulator linked one might be a bit complex from there. As Accucraft tend to use piston valves it might be possible to operate using just the reverser to control speed and direction. This will simplify RC install a lot.

Speed accusation could apply to the Accucraft Climax too. I mine has shown its ability to lift its skirts an run However, I think this might be the product of the longer throw of the pistons, compared to a Shay, and rods connecting to the drive shaft. The Climax looks more like a rodded loco in that respect (Ivatt Crab anyone ?). However, the Accucraft model is perfectly controllable at low speeds, but open up the regulator and watch it go. Gets over a others whining about "slow" geared locos making them follow at an unprototypically slow speed with their rodded locos. Inconsiderate speed freaks ! Max

Thanks for the comments Max - batteries and receiver can be mounted under a cab roof using the box provided by Fosworks (I'm using a temporary lashup of one of these in the oil bunker of the Accucraft Heisler I purchased at the GSSU weekend before last. It had a servo glued to the floor of the cab so I was able to get it under Radio Control the Friday I purchased it with spares I had at home.

Reverse servo can be the method I used for my Falk - removed the Johnson bar (by unbolting it) and fitted a servo in its place with a direct connection to the reversing rod (method used on my Roundhouse Davenport):



You can see the reversing servo in line with the pressure gauge and the servo on wall of the cab roof (no room on the floor with the Falk). Battery pack is in the bunker and the receiver is behind the cab roof backhead.

This is the servo bracket for the reverser (the link is actually upside down in the shot):



Has made the little beast controllable................

Another option is to remove the pump & fit a Goodall valve on a riser in the water tank which is what I will likely do to an Aster Shay - my 7/8" Decauville now has the gas tank under the floor and there is no apparent issue with temperature (Davenport & Falk gas tanks are in the cab).

 

[David Price]

I have commissioned both the Aster Climax and the Accucraft Unit. The Aster unit has the feedwater pump run off of the drive shaft and to keep the water level up it has to be run faster that scale speed.
The Accucraft Climax that I had commissioned had to have all of the clearances on the gear train reset. They wear either too tight of too loose and made for a very poor running engine. This is worth checking if you are planning on buying one. Once the clearances are set though they will run very nicely and slower than the Aster model.
Charles M

Thanks Charles,

that's the sort of feedback from owners I'm looking for.

 

[Northsider]

@David Price if you edit the photograph (a tiny crop will do) it will appear the right way up. It's a known bug on the Forum -no-one knows why! It seems to affect pics uploaded from phones more than desktop computers, I think.

 

[David Price]

Edit in Photoshop fixed the problem.

I'm not too confident about moving forward with these Lonely Planet servos - had one die on the Falk regulator just prior to the GSSU and one today on the Decauville. They are cheap, small and powerful - I'll buy one more batch but if this continues will go to a better(and bigger) servo.........

NB: I've decided not to purchase the Aster 3-truck Climax due to the scale, the speed it needs to run at and a number of other issues I've been advised of so this thread is probably finished for me.

Thanks to all who have contributed.