Aristocraft Revolution DCC Battery Kit ...... help and setup? WORKING OK NOW THANKS

[Timmo]

Hi Jon and Mike.

Been following your posts on the Revo DCC system. Are you able to confirm that all the DCC functions are readily and easily controllable from the handset. And I need to read the manual, I know!

I was thinking about using the Stanton handset and Tam Valley receiver, but the 2.4 GHz system of the Revo would seem to give a better range. What are your thoughts and conclusions?

Tim

 

[beavercreek]

Hi Tim
Under test it seems that all of the functions of the ESU Loksound 3.5 decoder are catered for. I have not tested it with the the V4.0 version.
I have not tested it yet with Massoth, QSI, TMC (of which makes I have decoders) or others which I do not own.
I use the ESU Lokprogrammer for the ESU boards and a Sprog III for the others when adjusting the parameters and function responses.

The range of the 'Revo' is very good and better than the Tam Valley/Stanton system which I have also tested.

It will be interesting to see the other forum members' results to see how compatible the Revo DCC system is with the whole range of makes of DCC decoders.... but if it works with ESU then it should work with the rest, but bearing in mind that there are sometimes little 'incompatibilities' between makes of decoders and other makes of controllers!

 

[Zerogee]

Hi Jon and Mike.

Been following your posts on the Revo DCC system. Are you able to confirm that all the DCC functions are readily and easily controllable from the handset. And I need to read the manual, I know!

I was thinking about using the Stanton handset and Tam Valley receiver, but the 2.4 GHz system of the Revo would seem to give a better range. What are your thoughts and conclusions?

Tim

Though I haven't yet had the time to test my Revo gear, with its arrival coinciding with an extremely busy period of work, I am sure that yes, its range will be a considerable improvement on the Stanton/TamValley setup - but it really depends on how large your garden and layout are as to how much this difference will make to you. The Stanton Cab is primarily designed for indoor layouts where range is not really as issue (unless you have a fifty-foot-long basement of course...), and my experiences with the standard one in the garden show a practical range of around 20-25 feet, rising to more like 35-40 feet with the slightly higher power handset that Neil Stanton was kind enough to supply me with as a one-off.
If no part of your layout is more than about twenty feet from your normal operating position, then the Tam/Stanton setup would still work well - I've had mine in use for a couple of years now with many visits to other GSS members' lines each summer, and it has all worked great - the thing is that even if the loco happens to go out of range for a short while, it just keeps running at the same speed until it comes back into range again.

You do get other benefits with the Revo, such as the display screen on the handset and much more communication between the handset and loco - so at the end of the day it will probably prove to be the better option, albeit slightly more expensive now even at Revo's current "sale" prices - if and when they put them back up to the full listed prices then it will be a much more expensive system.

Jon.

 

[PhilP]

Could someone who has the Revo DCC system running, just confirm you can operate functions above '9' please?

 

[dunnyrail]

Hi Jon and Mike.

Been following your posts on the Revo DCC system. Are you able to confirm that all the DCC functions are readily and easily controllable from the handset. And I need to read the manual, I know!

I was thinking about using the Stanton handset and Tam Valley receiver, but the 2.4 GHz system of the Revo would seem to give a better range. What are your thoughts and conclusions?

Tim

By Functions I presume that you mean being able to access things like the Whistle, Bell announcement etc? These are easily accesed by using Buttons 1-9 and 0. My very poor Vid linked below will allow you to sample some of these on my Test Rig.

However see Page 9 in the Manual Screen D sub para b) which shows access via the [#] button to:-
F0-9
F10-19
F20-28

Could someone who has the Revo DCC system running, just confirm you can operate functions above '9' please?

See above Phillip, not tried this yet so not sure how easy it will be to use in Operaion. The Chip that I have been testing (Loksound XL for a Shay) on has a couple of functions missing in that range that do not apear to do anything with the Revo or DCC so Function Maping may become quite important.

I do not have a manual for the Shay Sounds so perhaps need to investigate that. I will in the fullness of time test the Aristo DCC on a Massoth Tram chip and an LGB Sound Box, I have no resaon to believe at this time that they will not work adequately as has the Loksound Chip on this fine piece of kit.

Yes subject to the Function limitations (which may be mire imaginary than real till I get to test them out further) I rather like this super system as I also do the Analogue one which I have also used extensively.

Link to my PP Vid:-

The Vid timed out on me because my Phone Memory is full but I think it shows that the system works OK.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

From a cursory inspection of the manual (have not had time to wire my system up yet), it appears you can "link" 25 locos maximum.

Is that your understanding of the system?

Greg

 

[Cliff George]

My stuff is sitting on my desk untested so far. I read the manual.

I've no doubt that this will support all 29 DCC functions, my concern is that switching between blocks of functions is very unweildy.

So to use the first 10 functions in LOCO CONTROL mode I just press the corresponding number key - very easy.

However I now decide I want to activate F11, what do I do?

According to the manual (page 9) I have to alter the bank of functions that the number keys control. So "#" for quick program menu, "down arrow" to get to "FUNC x10 DIGIT", then "Enter" to select, "right arrow" to select bank F10 - F19 and possibly "Enter" again to select. Then I press "MENU" to return to LOCO CONTROL mode, then I press key 1 and function F11 activates. That is seven key presses to activate one function.

However it is worse. I am now stuck with the F10-F19 bank of functions selected, to go back to activating any function F0-F9 I have to basically repeat the above.

This is far too many button pushes. When controlling a loco all that is needed is to control speed and functions so all of these need to be easily selectable.

Please tell me that my reading of the manual is incorrect someone?

I would strongly suggest to Precision RC that in LOCO CONTROL mode they use an otherwise unused key to select the bank of functions that the number keys control. i.e. to get F11 in LOCO CONTROL mode I press the star button once to select F10-F19, then press key 1 to activate the function, to get back to select F1 I press the star button twice to select bank F0-F9 agan and then press 1 to activate the function. The selected bank of functions should be shown on the display. Not entirely sure which key(s) are free to be used in LOCO CONTROL mode,

Sorry if this sounds like a moan. The system looks very good but this inefficiant user interface does seem less than ideal. Thankfully it should be resolvable by a software update.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

your interpretation reflects mine.

Your suggestion is how my Zimo works. The NCE throttles work in a similar fashion.

Basically you need a 3 level shift key...

Yes it seems very unwieldy from the manual description

Greg

 

[Timmo]

From a cursory inspection of the manual (have not had time to wire my system up yet), it appears you can "link" 25 locos maximum.

Is that your understanding of the system?

Greg

Greg, from my reading of the manual there are 100 memory banks and each bank can store 25 loco profiles. i.e. 2500 loco profiles in total. But the question is, how do you access loco 26 and loco 51 etc, etc. The handset may just allow you to scroll through all the profiles in all memory banks, but do you have to select each memory bank by a series of key strokes.

All will be revealed when I manage to get my hands on a set.

Tim

 

[PhilP]

The problem is the menu system has been designed by 'A Programmer'.. And we all know that they do not think in the same was as 'normal' human beings!

 

[dunnyrail]

The problem is the menu system has been designed by 'A Programmer'.. And we all know that they do not think in the same was as 'normal' human beings!

I have thought about doing an idiots guide to getting started with this Aristo DCC System, just need some more rainy days to play as my new station is taking priority during the fine weather and around this time of day Pub o Clock is creating a lack of action!

 

[Greg Elmassian]

the memory in banks really flys in the face of DCC's flexibility.

with 4 digit addressing, it normally no issue to have unique locomotive IDs based on the road number. I have more than 25 locos and on my Zimo system I can go to the storage unit, pick up a locomotive put it on the track... enter it's road number and press one key and I am talking to it.

being constrained to 25 locos at a time means I might pick up 2 locos that are not in the same bank... now how do I control them? Worse, I'll bet consisting is impossible...

An unnecessary constraint from what I can tell of the hardware...

Greg

 

[dunnyrail]

your interpretation reflects mine.

Your suggestion is how my Zimo works. The NCE throttles work in a similar fashion.

Basically you need a 3 level shift key...

Yes it seems very unwieldy from the manual description

Greg

I have a cheep Bike Light that I bought from Lidl. I have just walked the dog with it on in the dark. I press the one button to get light on, next press gets flashing light, next press gets manic flashing light and the next press turns it off. Surely for the Aristo rather than the clunky option of:-
F10-19
Press
#
Down Arrow (to FUNC x10 DIGIT)
Right Arrow
Menu selects now shows FUNC(1)

F20 and above
As above but press Right Arrow twice
Menu selects now shows FUNC(2)

To return
As above but press Left Arrow relevant number of times to return to 0

Very very clunky. In my Cheep Light Scenario why not just press say F1 3 times to get F21 or twice to get F11, simples and very quick? The next single press would always be F1 or multiples as suggested.

Having said all that I rarely use other than F0-9 as I find that in running the act of having to shift makes things not worth the hastle. Too slow to react and I can rarely even remember 10 Functions without a reminder in my mit. Thus Function Mapping to give me the most usable Sounds that are heard regularly becomes an even greater requirement for me with the Aristo DCC Systeem.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

I have a number of decoders that regularly use F11-F25.... notably F13 and F14 are volume up and down, so this is not "nit picking" but how it would affect me.

Also I have enough functions that even remapping them would need a "shift" beyond F9...

For many people this is not a big deal, but it would interfere with most of my running.

The limitation in the memory banks to what appears to be 25 locos at a time is severe for me, as I use the actual road number as the address.

Greg

 

[PhilP]

The problem is the 'new' is based on the existing hardware (and software) so has a number of assumptions / limitations brought into the equation from there..

It is an answer to a problem, but is starting from a point already having gone down a different road.

Not knocking the achievement, it is the architecture it has been built on which is limiting the 'user experience', I am guessing?

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Actually, the limited number of loco ID's was in the very first Revolution, which I helped specify and beta test. Seems to have stuck in the architecture of the software... the first units only could handle 50 locos, later ones 100 (in terms of unique locos linked to the throttle)

Greg

 

[dunnyrail]

Actually, the limited number of loco ID's was in the very first Revolution, which I helped specify and beta test. Seems to have stuck in the architecture of the software... the first units only could handle 50 locos, later ones 100 (in terms of unique locos linked to the throttle)

Greg

Hm I have not found the numbers in either kit to be an issue, I have used the description to get my Locomotives described by quite large numbers. But I see that Blocks of 25 on Loco Num being the Chip Number can be somewaht restrictive if you want Battery Locomotives to be releted to their chip number that must be No. 25 or less with some duplicated for a large fleet. So yes I concur a bit of an issue that I will be able to work around to a lesser or great extent. On that basis that I am looking to go all Battery in the near future Aristo DCC is the workaround that will allow that to happen (finally for me). I suspect that in the future the only Electric Track Power used will be in my Shed where I can run a smallish end to end representing a French Light Railway.