Am I using the right kind of vinegar?

I already had vinegar JimmyB so it seemed the logical choice. I haven't been too impressed with the results but that is probably due to the amount of dirt, oil, grease etc.

SW
 
Sarah, your post reminded me I had put some fishplates into clean last night. With an old toothbrush, a quick clean in white spirit to remove grease, rinse in light soapy water, and soaked in 50/50 rilrock/water:

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Greg Elmassian said:
Why is copper grease popular on this forum? Is it just because it is one of the various anti-sieze formulations? (I use the nickel-based stuff myself)

Greg
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1. A heck of a lot cheaper than the LGB product!
2. 'Old school' and available in most motor-factors (even the big DIY sheds seem to have it.

Can't say I have seen a nickel-based product.. - But haven't looked..
 
Sarah, did you add some salt to your vinegar? It makes the vinegar more reactive and made a huge difference compared to without salt. I'm not sure on the specific chemistry of why. Only needs a few spoons per liter.
The last lot of points I did only took about an hour or so to come up shiny new. I was concerned with the one with old bird droppings all over so left in overnight. It came up just as good after some wire brushing. I think bird droppings are alkaline, the opposite to acidity so the vinegar would eat into that. There was no tarnishing underneath.

Below is before rinsing and finishing off with a brush after soaking for an hour or so. You can still see the orange colour from the copper content in the brass. The sleepers needed a good scrub along the 'wood grain' and at an angle from the back to get their sides with detergent too. They had a layer of stubborn grunge all over.
Probably best to soak filthy track in hot/warm water then scrub with detergent first to make way for the vinegar and avoid contaminating it as much.
White vinegar only cost me $1 a liter at the supermarket so it's a cheap solution.

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Paradise said:
Sarah, did you add some salt to your vinegar? It makes the vinegar more reactive and made a huge difference compared to without salt. I'm not sure on the specific chemistry of why.
The last lot of points I did only took about an hour or so to come up shiny new. I was concerned with the one with old bird droppings all over so left in overnight. It came up just as good after some wire brushing. I think bird droppings are alkaline, the opposite to acidity so the vinegar would eat into that. There was no tarnishing underneath.
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Don't pour it on any part of the garden you want to grow stuff, or spill it on the lawn, it's a great weed killer!
 
JimmyB said:
Sarah, I am unsure why you are even using vinegar, you started a thread on cleaning track, and there were lots of good ideas, most of which work. I use kilrock, gel on track, and liquid to soak (neat is verrry strong)

Descaler

Descaler

  • Media owner JimmyB
  • Date added
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Just been looking at where I can get this rather than order via the net. Robert Dyass appear to keep it if you have one near you. I may go to Doncaster as it is the easiest one for me to get to for me!
 
G-force1 said:
Don't pour it on any part of the garden you want to grow stuff, or spill it on the lawn, it's a great weed killer!
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Yes, we regularly use the large catering bottles of white vinegar as a very effective and pet-safe weedkiller for between the blocks on the drive and patio - makes the place smell like the local Chippy for a week or so, but certainly does the job on the weeds!

Jon.
 
dunnyrail said:
Just been looking at where I can get this rather than order via the net. Robert Dyass appear to keep it if you have one near you. I may go to Doncaster as it is the easiest one for me to get to for me!
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Hmm, will have to have a look in Robert Dyas.... I've been ordering the Kilrock Gel from Amazon, comes post-free in about three days. Very effective stuff, thanks again to Jimmy for putting me on to it!

Jon.
 
Strange, I've been running my railway since 2003 and have never had the need to use vinegar or other substitutes on my track joiners.....
 
KentKeith said:
Strange, I've been running my railway since 2003 and have never had the need to use vinegar or other substitutes on my track joiners.....
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Sarah has bought some second hand track that is pretty grubby - joiners and track ends will tend to oxidize if left lying around and not kept connected.

I don't worry about cleaning track per se apart from cleaning the rail head for running, but when re-laying previously enjoyed track, there's often a bit of cleaning to do :nod::nod:
 
KentKeith said:
Strange, I've been running my railway since 2003 and have never had the need to use vinegar or other substitutes on my track joiners.....
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As RHINO says, old second hand track that Sarah has can indeed be a bit mucky (some from me(was all yours bought new?)). I have some track here for my next station that came from the same source, it had been left out on a permanent line after the owners death without any use for a lot of years. Serious cleaning job with the rail ends. I will be using Track Clamps so the needs for cleaning may be a little reduced.
 
I agree with JimmyB and there is an important point:

Acids will remove oxidation on metal... BARE metal...

Notice JimmyB indicated he cleaned with spirits first?

This is as he stated to remove any grease first... because with grease you do NOT have BARE metal... and the acid will not clean through the grease.

By the way, the anti-seize greases are very "sticky", which is why they protect well, but are hell to remove...

copper is usually used on head gaskets, but nickle is more common (higher temp)

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Greg Elmassian said:
copper is usually used on head gaskets, but nickle is more common (higher temp)
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Modern day compound head gaskets should be fitted completely clean and dry, unless the manufacturer says otherwise. They are designed to stick to both block and head (can be an absolute PITA to remove). Lubes may be used on all-metal gaskets to help them move as they are tightened.
 
I was referring to all metal head gaskets, but we digress... I learned about anti-sieze in 1969 when I tried removing the clutch assembly from a mini cooper... the bolt with 250 ft-lbs of torque was the easy part... the puller with the 8 foot torque bar was fun... that was the last time it was assembled without anti-sieze.... also 3/4" reach spark plugs in soft aluminum motorcycle heads, when they sieze and you remove the threads with the plug... argh!
 
Greg Elmassian said:
I was referring to all metal head gaskets, but we digress... I learned about anti-sieze in 1969 when I tried removing the clutch assembly from a mini cooper... the bolt with 250 ft-lbs of torque was the easy part... the puller with the 8 foot torque bar was fun... that was the last time it was assembled without anti-sieze.... also 3/4" reach spark plugs in soft aluminum motorcycle heads, when they sieze and you remove the threads with the plug... argh!
Click to expand...


That's why they invented Heli-coils! ;):rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
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