Reverse Loop

[CoggesRailway]

As you can see from my thread "ok what have I done so far" I have a section of track through my garage where the "up" and "down" side of the loop are running as parallel twin tracks. It would add to the interest a lot if I could put some points across to allow me to reverse train direction.

But as I have things set up it is just going to short out? Is there a product/method to deal with this issue? At the moment I am on analogue with everything live simultaneously- apart from sidings which I have switches to isolate so I can park locos in them.

Ian

 

[CoggesRailway]

Just did a google search and am now even more confused... hoping I can buy some black magic which will just make it work!!

 

[whatlep]

CoggesRailway - 5/11/2009 10:52 AM

As you can see from my thread "ok what have I done so far" I have a section of track through my garage where the "up" and "down" side of the loop are running as parallel twin tracks. It would add to the interest a lot if I could put some points across to allow me to reverse train direction.

But as I have things set up it is just going to short out? Is there a product/method to deal with this issue? At the moment I am on analogue with everything live simultaneously
(snip)
Ian

Hello Ian

This is one of those questions to which there are straightforward answers, but they may not be what you want. If you simply add points, you will immediately have a short circuit as you suggest. In DCC, the solution is simple. You buy a reversing loop module, connect it in and you can run through the loop non-stop. Easy peasy!

In analogue the solution is not simple and you will not be able to run through the new crossover without stopping the train and intervening manually. Depending on your level of confidence working with electrical components and switches there are solutions using a double-pole, double-throw [DPDT] switch or using diodes. In this instance, where you probably want to retain the ability to run around the layout non-stop when not using the new connecting points, I'd go for a DPDT solution.

A good summary of the things to consider and the wiring required is given in parts 1 & 3 of the attached link:
http://rail.felgall.com/rlt.htm

If you look at part 3 in that article, don't be put off by its complexity. Sections C and D are all you really need, with (in your case) section D being the only electrical connection for the entire layout, other than the vital reversing section (C). What it comes down to is providing a way of connecting section C to section D electrically with normal and reversed polarity. The positioning of the isolating joints is vital - you'll need 6 as shown in the diagram.

Good luck!

 

[CoggesRailway]

Many thanks. I think I need to consider DCC at some point and until then keep things simple! Will investigate DPDT first.

 

[Wobbleboxer]

If you're only running loop to loop, and are happy to go round the loops the same way each time, there is a straightforward way of continuous running with DC wiring via a DPDT switch. A diagram would explain but I can't upload pics at work so unless someone comes along in the meantime I''l try and do something later this evening.

[attachment deleted by admin]

 

[Wobbleboxer]

Managed to get the diagram up but it wouldn't let me edit the text. If the ends are hard wired, the loop can be switched via a DPDT when the train is in the loop. You will need to enter each loop the same way each time though and manually throw the switch, although I guess this could be done with reed switches??

 

[Bram]

You could consider battery RC then track cleaning ans reverse loops are never a problem

 

[Gizzy]

For a reversong loop with Analogue DC control, and if you are not electrically minded or confident with soldering diodes, you could consider the LGB 1015T reversing loop set....

 

[whatlep]

Gizzy - 5/11/2009 4:39 PM

For a reversong loop with Analogue DC control, and if you are not electrically minded or confident with soldering diodes, you could consider the LGB 1015T reversing loop set....

This won't work with the configuration Cogges proposes: a dog bone loop with a new crossover in the middle. Fine for a standalone loop of course.

 

[Gizzy]

whatlep - 5/11/2009 5:23 PM

Gizzy - 5/11/2009 4:39 PM

For a reversong loop with Analogue DC control, and if you are not electrically minded or confident with soldering diodes, you could consider the LGB 1015T reversing loop set....

This won't work with the configuration Cogges proposes: a dog bone loop with a new crossover in the middle. Fine for a standalone loop of course.

That's very true Whatlep!

I should have said that Ian will need a 1015T set for each reverse loop in the dogbone and it isn't a cheap option either admittedly. I would encourage him to go for the cheaper DPDT switch solution, but the LGB solution is an alternative for the electronically terrified!

 

[Wobbleboxer]

If its a short term thing until you can expand in the garden, I'd recommend a cheap option. If you can re-use it later then more expense now might be justifiable.

 

[C&S]

Hi Ian,

Installation of a DPDT switched section would not be very difficult, only needing the two points and some insulated rail joiners plus the change-over switch; however in it's simple form means you'd need to stop the train on the loop so as to change the switch, before continuing. As you have sidings in the vicinity and could potentially install the new cross-over facing in either direction would you like to show us a sketch of what you want to do? I could then provide a suggested wiring diagram, if you'd like one. (When I've discovered how to post images on here - I've only just arrived from GSM.

 

[Neil Robinson]

In support of the previous post a track diagram would be most helpful.
A crossover formed of two points would allow trains to travel the other way round, but I'm pretty sure you'd need another crossover of the opposite hand to permit the train to return to the initial direction of travel at some time.
If you were to make room for a scissors crossover this may make things easier as all four points could be operated together giving only two possible states for the electrical switching. If you look at the alternative you will see that if all four points were changed simultaneously you could change a train over, only to change it straight back again unless they were a long way apart, giving sufficient time and space to change back in the face of an oncoming train.

 

[johnsaintjim]

<p>

CoggesRailway - 5/11/2009 10:52 AM Is there a product/method to deal with this issue?

</p><p>Yes Ian... live steam and battery power </p>

 

[CoggesRailway]

Hi All, first thankyou for all your help and diagrams it really is so kind and helpful. I have decided in the short term to do with out as I am no where near extingushing my enjoyment in what I have so far. I think the next step will be to think about digital at which point things will get easier. For the record I planned something that looked like neil's "alternative" diagram. What i will do is turn my longest siding into a passing loop allow a low tech way to get on the other end of a train! Many thanks again.

 

[vannerley]

Our line is - in effect - a loop to loop with single track betwixt. The Domburg loop has an LGB loop track in it, which is a double isolator in one half length piece of track followed by a diode matrix track also half length (as many here will already know). The circle of track around the wild-life pond has a home-made arrangement - I was able to get some LGB diodes as spares and made up the matrix myself: it's in a plastic box inside a Lineside Delights corrugated hut.

There is no difference in operation and we reverse power simply by throwing the switch on the Gaugemaster controller. with practice the operators can be slick enough that the train does not stop at all. The Gaugemaster controller is built into a home-made walkabout box on a long lead that will (eventually) be able to be plugged into the control cable at several locations; it also has DPDT centre off switches built into it that will control the three points needed to separate the steam/diesel and electric tram routes.

 

[craigrailinc]

we used a reverse loop with DPDT switches on it. two of these one on each point and then in the loops (as it was a dogbone) I used two magnetic switches in each loop close together. the first one changed the point nearest the train and then the next one the other point. there was no need tostop trains in the loop or reverse power. The two magnetic switches were about 2 inches apart and worked fine the ponts were about 150 feet apart and changed right away.
in saying all that I bough more track this year and did away with it to alow me to run more than one train at a time.