Pick up shoes

[duncan1_9_8_4]

Once one of my most reliable locomotives. All of a sudden, the shoes have started sticking and not bouncing back into place. This is causing derailments when it won't push in, and lack of receiving track power. I've changed for brand new, oiled, and still the problem persists. For now I've taken them off, and it runs perfectly. But why would they do this and how to rectify. Oil hasn't worked. Grease hasn't worked. Brand new shoes haven't worked. Any ideas? The locomotive is, as is, since new and not meddled with.

 

[PhilP]

This is usually due to bad pickup from the carbon brushes on the wheels..
This means all the current is going through the skates, generating heat and affecting the guides in the motor-block. The springs can also be affected by heat, making them less 'springy'.

I would not use oil or grease. - Gathers 'crud' and becomes sticky.
I would use a little graphite powder.

Strip and clean the ways the skates run in.
Check for wear and ridges, on the carbon brushes.
Clean tyres and wheel-backs, to ensure good current collection.
Check for burrs / deformation around the skates.

Oil and grease act as insulator, so make sure there is not an excess within the block, and that contact strips are not contaminated.

PhilP.

 

[duncan1_9_8_4]

This is usually due to bad pickup from the carbon brushes on the wheels..
This means all the current is going through the skates, generating heat and affecting the guides in the motor-block. The springs can also be affected by heat, making them less 'springy'.

I would not use oil or grease. - Gathers 'crud' and becomes sticky.
I would use a little graphite powder.

Strip and clean the ways the skates run in.
Check for wear and ridges, on the carbon brushes.
Clean tyres and wheel-backs, to ensure good current collection.
Check for burrs / deformation around the skates.

Oil and grease act as insulator, so make sure there is not an excess within the block, and that contact strips are not contaminated.

PhilP.

I've taken it all apart over the last hour, cleaned, dried.... The carbon brushes are perfect, no crud, brand new skates, clean wheels. Nothing. Still stiff as heck, so I've left them off.

There doesn't appear to be any difference in how the locomotive runs, if anything a bit quieter....

Bamboozled. Fine last week....

 

[PhilP]

I've taken it all apart over the last hour, cleaned, dried.... The carbon brushes are perfect, no crud, brand new skates, clean wheels. Nothing. Still stiff as heck, so I've left them off.

Strange..

When I have seen this, there has normally been some melting/deformation in the block / channel the skate sits in?

I believe there is more than one type of skate? - Are you sure you have the correct ones?

PhilP.

 

[duncan1_9_8_4]

Strange..

When I have seen this, there has normally been some melting/deformation in the block / channel the skate sits in?

I believe there is more than one type of skate? - Are you sure you have the correct ones?

PhilP.

Yeah, like for like skates. I'm stumped. Luckily it works just as well without them.

 

[dunnyrail]

Hm I wonder if the springs could be the issue, but the new ones will have come with new springs? Still if it works without them ok. You can get away with it on a big double bogie loco.

 

[Diesel2000]

It can take some playing around with. I've had sticky ones I've replaced with new shoes and springs and that fixed the stickiness. Others I've had to work the skate a bit to get it to sit properly. They are pretty flexible metal and can bend easily. Also there are differing versions of skates with slightly different shapes.

I have that same loco 20121 and while havent had any skate issues I've had others. It was an experiment with how low end parts they could use. The motors are not typical buehler and I found they produce a large enough magnet field to trigger track hall sensors and reed switches. I had to add shielding to the motor block covers to prevent them from triggering those sensors. Very strange design. The lighting is also horrendous. One all that was addressed its one of my favorites and switching workhorse with auto couplers.

 

[duncan1_9_8_4]

Hm I wonder if the springs could be the issue, but the new ones will have come with new springs? Still if it works without them ok. You can get away with it on a big double bogie loco.

Yep brand new springs, very odd. I've had them seize before, but normally a dab of wd40 or something sorts it.

 

[duncan1_9_8_4]

It can take some playing around with. I've had sticky ones I've replaced with new shoes and springs and that fixed the stickiness. Others I've had to work the skate a bit to get it to sit properly. They are pretty flexible metal and can bend easily. Also there are differing versions of skates with slightly different shapes.

I have that same loco 20121 and while havent had any skate issues I've had others. It was an experiment with how low end parts they could use. The motors are not typical buehler and I found they produce a large enough magnet field to trigger track hall sensors and reed switches. I had to add shielding to the motor block covers to prevent them from triggering those sensors. Very strange design. The lighting is also horrendous. One all that was addressed its one of my favorites and switching workhorse with auto couplers.

Yeah, questionable detail, but it's a go to easy locomotive to get out and run. Given my track is filthy at the moment because of constant wet rails, it runs as good as with skates, but I'll keep an eye on it.

 

[Gerard]

Duncan,

You can find a lot of possible improvements for picking up the current in our new book "Our Model Garden Railway".
See Our Model Garden Railway: Schrieck, Bart van der, Kleinsteuber, Rainer: 9798285485971: Amazon.com: Books
In this book Rainer describes in detail some improvements he has made as an expert on the subject.
He also sells his improved parts via his website at "B&B De Jachtkamer" , such as stainless steel brush skates.(see attachment)
His mail address is::
rainer.kleinsteuber@gmail.com