Need new control system, need options (DC, Battery or Digital...)

Henri

Henri

refuses to grow up
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My beloved Aristocraft Train Engineer remote is going south. Tried to repair it by replacing buttons, but the functions remain ‘broken’ (see other topic).

So I’m hunting for a new system to control my tiny layout. A few ’requirements’

  • Remote control!!!
  • Low budget!!!
  • Only trains, no points or other accessories
  • No sound in loco’s, decouplers, opening doors, etc, etc.
  • Current stock is 7 locomotives, of which 4 are used frequently
  • Can only run 1 locomotive at once
  • Setup as easy as possible, I hate working/programming computers in my spare time (thats why 3D printing is no fun for me)

So my options are:
  • Get another Aristocraft remote: possibly with the same issues mine currently has...
  • Find another DC remote system track powered: who does make this?
  • Go digital. So many manufacturers, so many options... Piko has a starter set for only E 150,- but I can’t seem to find the appropriate decoders to go with this system
  • Go battery and RC. Also Piko has a nice set, but also Deltang pops to mind. Drawback on the Piko system that each loco has it’s own remote...

I certainly could use some directions and advice here. This is no fun, I had no intention to swich to another control system.
 
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As you would expect, Henri, I would put in a vote for Deltang. It meets all of your requirements (and a few others in case you decide to widen your brief). I believe it works out cheaper than DCC systems (at least I did when I converted to RC).

You could opt for a Tx22 which can independently control up to twelve locos, but if you only ever run one loco at a time, then you could buy a cheaper Tx20 or even a Tx10 and just bind all your locos to the same transmitter.

I know you are familiar with my railway but here are some links to some of my Deltang related videos which might be of interest.

The Tx22 transmitter (Also available from Micron)

The Tx20 transmitter. (Which can also be purchased from Micron )

Here's an example of using the auto-station stop feature which is built into the Rx65c receiver (along with auto shuttle and auto buffer stop)

Rik
 
PS - If you don't fancy converting all your locos to battery, you could always use an Rx66 to control the feed to the tracks.
 
Rik, thanks for the extensive post about the different RC’s. Since I’ve heard about Deltang I really like the system, options and pricing.

So one needs only one RC, a receiver/controller and batterypack per loco?
For an average battery pack, what would you advice? I think my running habits & stock is very much alike yours.

The Rx65c with auto shuttle is also VERY tempting... It can make an interesting automated running session.
 
Hi Henri,

If you wish to use NiMH cells, then 6-8 (7.2-9.6V) will be adequate for 'branch-line' speeds.
Alternatively, a '2S' Lithium pack, will give 7.4V in a smaller space, and possibly a longer running time?

PhilP.
 
hmm, lowest cost would be a single "trackside" system so you don't convert 7 locos... low cost was your priority right?

Why not the Aristo Revolution trackside, and get it in the "linear" version, in case you pick up some analog sound cards.

updated_TE_pic.jpg

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Inexpensive, lots of power, proven. Since you are running only one train at a time, just connect to the rails, no other modifications needed.

Greg
 
I just went to battery power and install a g scale graphics Rail Boss 4, found it extremely easy to install uses a push button controller just a little bigger than a car remote and works great, price was also very attractive as well, love it
 
Henri said:
Rik, thanks for the extensive post about the different RC’s. Since I’ve heard about Deltang I really like the system, options and pricing.
So one needs only one RC, a receiver/controller and battery pack per loco?
For an average battery pack, what would you advice? I think my running habits & stock is very much alike yours.
Click to expand...
Just one transmitter - and then one receiver and battery pack per loco.
If you decide to keep track power, then all you will need is one transmitter and one receiver.

Personally, I prefer battery power. No more track cleaning, no more worrying about electrical continuity. BUT, all seven locos will need a receiver and a battery pack. A battery pack is around €10 if you go for li ion, and a receiver is around €40, so will cost you around €50 per loco.

Keeping to track power is less expensive, if you don't include hours spent cleaning track and tracing electrical faults.


Henri said:
The Rx65c with auto shuttle is also VERY tempting... It can make an interesting automated running session.
Click to expand...

A nice additional feature!

Rik
 
Can thoroughly recommend battery power, possibly not the cheapest way to go if you look at 7 locomotives. But hey you do not need to do them all at once, perhaps budget for 2 say the Railcar and your favorite loco as a starting point. Others can be added when and if you can afford them. I have just spent a very enjoyable 4 hours in the Garden running trains, no track cleaning just running one of my Timetables.
 
So the battery pack is the one that gives max voltage. If it says 7.4V it means the max voltage provided to the motor is 7.4V?
Does that provide enough ’speed’?

And then what current does an engine use? I use old Stainz engines and Otto engines.
I know it is very difficult to predict running time as there are so many parameters involved, but for a single motor locomotive, a 7,4V 1300mAh package, what running time could one expect? Hauling 3 - 4 wagons? One hour? Two hours? Half an hour?
 
All sensible questions:

Yes, the battery voltage set's the maximum speed.. - If you have a meter, or some batteries, you can power a loco with this voltage, as an experiment.

The LGB motor's are very efficient, and take less then an amp (very old, worn motor's take more).

A 1300mAh battery pack, will give you two hours constant running, at top speed.. - This is a 'guesstimate' based on my experience. You will probably get longer, as you will not be running flat-our, or constantly during a running-session.
Lights, curve-radius, gradients, length of train.. - All these will affect your running time.

As an example:
The Rx65c receiver/controller, is rated for a supply of 3-13V, so 3-8 NiMH cells, a '3S' Lithium, single 12V lead-acid, or (for tiny loco's) a 'PP3'-style battery.

Hope this helps?
PhilP.
 
Henri said:
So the battery pack is the one that gives max voltage. If it says 7.4V it means the max voltage provided to the motor is 7.4V?
Does that provide enough ’speed’?

And then what current does an engine use? I use old Stainz engines and Otto engines.
I know it is very difficult to predict running time as there are so many parameters involved, but for a single motor locomotive, a 7,4V 1300mAh package, what running time could one expect? Hauling 3 - 4 wagons? One hour? Two hours? Half an hour?
Click to expand...
My experience is mostly with Fosworks though I do have a couple of Deltang, one that was redone yesterday so I can give it a workout today to see what it will pull but it is not LGB powered. I was running my LGB Railcar yesterday and it was charged last August and has been powered up for 13 hours. Not running all that time mostly sat with the MLS Sound system burbliing away and running as and when. Some time back I did do a test of my 20761 0-4-0 similar to a Stainz. It managed around 3.5 hours actual running with a Sound Card as well. This has 10aa NiMh for 14.4 v. Uses an Arosto Card so somewhat different to the Deltang.
 
I've got over 12 hours running from a 3S (11.1v) pack of 18650 li ions. When fully charged it delivers around 12.5v.

I've not measured the run time in my other locos but I'm sure they must be around the same.

Rik
 
After a good night of sleep I’ve decided to go for the Deltang. Starting with the Rx66 so I can run ALL trains, and start converting them one by one when money allows. As I’m fully into the RTM line, I think I will sell a few items now and then to free up money for Rx, batteries and parts to build more RTM stock.

Thanks everyone for sharing your experiences
 
Henri said:
My beloved Aristocraft Train Engineer remote is going south. Tried to repair it by replacing buttons, but the functions remain ‘broken’ (see other topic).

So I’m hunting for a new system to control my tiny layout. A few ’requirements’

  • Remote control!!!
  • Low budget!!!
  • Only trains, no points or other accessories
  • No sound in loco’s, decouplers, opening doors, etc, etc.
  • Current stock is 7 locomotives, of which 4 are used frequently
  • Can only run 1 locomotive at once
  • Setup as easy as possible, I hate working/programming computers in my spare time (thats why 3D printing is no fun for me)

So my options are:
  • Get another Aristocraft remote: possibly with the same issues mine currently has...
  • Find another DC remote system track powered: who does make this?
  • Go digital. So many manufacturers, so many options... Piko has a starter set for only E 150,- but I can’t seem to find the appropriate decoders to go with this system
  • Go battery and RC. Also Piko has a nice set, but also Deltang pops to mind. Drawback on the Piko system that each loco has it’s own remote...

I certainly could use some directions and advice here. This is no fun, I had no intention to swich to another control system.
Click to expand...
Have you considered using the Piko remote control, I have successfully used it on 2 analogue layouts controlling track power as the Aristo does, you can use the same transformer for your power supply I see you are not based in the UK but if you look at the link you should be able to see. Piko 35040 R/C Receiver with Pocket Remote G Scale - TopSlots n Trains
 
Thanks Hutch, it's an old one I had on my site, the latest is enclosed and they finally decided to at least offer the fan (I think it should be standard)... but when one of the top priorities was low budget, and then 7 receivers and 7 batteries was proposed vs a single transmitter and a single trackside receiver, I figured I should not make people mad by repeating myself.. (as I just have :wasntme:)

Greg
 
Greg: the option you posted certainly is interesting! And looking at 7 installs it definitely is cheapest.
But now I’m reconsidering all options battery is for me the most convenient. Especially when I’m up & running (track power) in no time and I can convert engines over time as budget allows. To not have to clean track anymore and be able to run everywhere, is very tempting!
 
Henri said:
Greg: the option you posted certainly is interesting! And looking at 7 installs it definitely is cheapest.
But now I’m reconsidering all options battery is for me the most convenient. Especially when I’m up & running (track power) in no time and I can convert engines over time as budget allows. To not have to clean track anymore and be able to run everywhere, is very tempting!
Click to expand...
With Deltang you can have up to 12 locomotives with just one transmitter. It is possible to have more than one running as I proved last night with my 2 Deltang powered Steam Trams.

I know that you have been looking at my posts on the Trams and that thread has much on it about the setup. I have not yet tested those two for battery length of run (too cold to hang outside yesterday), but I imagine the norm with smaller locomotives would be 3-5 hours at least with roughly 8 (Max for Deltang) NiMH batteries. That pretty well fits with your notes of battery pack and a Rx65c which is what I am using. You can if you want at a future date add a My Loco Sound to this setup, the Diesel Unit one is great and the Steam are good but the whistles could be improved. I use the Thomas Whistle as it sounds pretty good for a small loco and not too electronic. All the other sounds are now properly synthesised so are good.
 
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