Maximum cable run - Massoth Central Station

Slawman

Slawman

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Hi all,

Does anyone have an idea on the maximum cable run I could use to hook my Central station up to the running line?

I am looking at permanently re-locating the central station to my workshop which would need a run of about 30 meters (90 feet). The voltage drop is fine just not sure if there are any specifics to consider in relation to the DCC signals?

I run 22v at 8 amps.
 
I wouldn't have thought the cable run distance would be a problem, particularly if you use a suitably heavy cable - but one thing to consider is radio range for wireless Navigators.... assuming your radio module will be located near the Dimax CS, at 90-100 feet you might be pushing the range on any Navis using the "standard" radio boards? If you have the extended-range ones with the rat-tail antennae, then they should be fine.

Jon.
 
That's a good point Jon. I have a 5 to 10m cable connecting the wireless up to the bus (just the cable it comes with) so I may be able to locate the tx/rx closer to the track.
 
Slawman said:
Hi all,

Does anyone have an idea on the maximum cable run I could use to hook my Central station up to the running line?

I am looking at permanently re-locating the central station to my workshop which would need a run of about 30 meters (90 feet). The voltage drop is fine just not sure if there are any specifics to consider in relation to the DCC signals?

I run 22v at 8 amps.
Click to expand...
My CS is locate some 90 feet from the furthest Switched Section District with no problems.

Regarding Radio I did find that the as fitted RC Aerials were somewhat challenged at this distance. So they were swopped out for the longer range ones (they have a Rats Tail hanging out from them) with no further problems.
 
Not a clue, probably not as I tend to have max 4 x Double Motored and 3 other Single Motored Locs on the line at any time, never even checked to see what the Draw is but never any problems with shut downs. Also they would not all be on the longest extent at any one time, the max would only occur at Timetable Start Up where 3 x Double and 1 x single motored would be at that longest run. So was my reply relevent?
 
'Real world' information is always relevant Jon.. - I would guess 4.5 - 5 Amps for that load..

As well as power, there IS the DCC signal to think about.. A heavy cable is a good idea. Either a 'Belden' data-cable with (say) four twisted pairs, and parallel them up, or a 'twin and earth' type of mains cable. - The latter whilst not 'twisted pair' will have the two main conductors parallel, so will act as a transmission-line. Better than some random two-core cable.

If locating your wireless unit away from the CS (possibly outside, with some height), please be aware the data connectors will not like 'weather'. - Neither will the unit itself.
If you mount it in an enclosure: Heat-soak may be a problem. Possibly condensation.

If you get regular electrical storms: Seriously consider disconnecting feeds from CS at the end of a session, and coil them a few feet away from the electronics.
 
My garden is about 100ft x 60ft. I've set up two power zones with multiple feeds into the track. I've used ordinary domestic 240volt cable for all the long distance feeds, the longer ones of which have been buried under the pathway that runs the length of the garden.
 
Similar to Keith here. The CS is in the bedroom, out of the way, mains cable feed wires about 50 ft. Radio, no problem to the end of garden, about 150ft, unless I put the navvy on the ground - then it sometimes drops out. The extended range one is slightly, but noticeably, better.
 
PhilP said:
'Real world' information is always relevant Jon.. - I would guess 4.5 - 5 Amps for that load..

As well as power, there IS the DCC signal to think about.. A heavy cable is a good idea. Either a 'Belden' data-cable with (say) four twisted pairs, and parallel them up, or a 'twin and earth' type of mains cable. - The latter whilst not 'twisted pair' will have the two main conductors parallel, so will act as a transmission-line. Better than some random two-core cable.

If locating your wireless unit away from the CS (possibly outside, with some height), please be aware the data connectors will not like 'weather'. - Neither will the unit itself.
If you mount it in an enclosure: Heat-soak may be a problem. Possibly condensation.

If you get regular electrical storms: Seriously consider disconnecting feeds from CS at the end of a session, and coil them a few feet away from the electronics.
Click to expand...
My original LGB Reciever and Data sender was located outside but under an awning, this did cause problems with the Aerial Rusting. On my current line the Massoth one is locate in the Shed by a Window looking over the majority of the Garden and has operated like this just fine since I moved here nearly 6 years ago now. Certainly mounting some LGB Reverce Modules outside in a Plastic Lunch Box did them no good at all on the Ruschbahn, though they did last around 5 years. We allhave to learn things!

Unhinging things prior to a storm and when going on Holidays is always a good idea, I expect many of us will have seen the fried DCC Garden Railway kit in Garden Railways some years back.
 
Thanks Guys,

Based on feedback I am going to give it a go. I will also use a mains extension cord (Bunnings seems to be able to buy copper below the market on occasion).

The lightning risk has got me a bit freaked out through. I imagine a decent strike will fry everything. Does that happen very often (based on forum experience?).
 
Slawman said:
Thanks Guys,

Based on feedback I am going to give it a go. I will also use a mains extension cord (Bunnings seems to be able to buy copper below the market on occasion).

The lightning risk has got me a bit freaked out through. I imagine a decent strike will fry everything. Does that happen very often (based on forum experience?).
Click to expand...

I'm sure it's not THAT common, BUT there are definitely cases of it happening..... just to be safe rather than sorry, I would always make a habit of pulling the green plug out of the back of the Dimax CS and move it away from the unit when not actually playing trains (and unplug the mains power to the CS as well). Thirty seconds to plug them back in before each running session is little compared with a fried system......

Jon.
 
I have had a line outside for most of the last 15 years (with a break here and there) with no noticeable issue but not too much in the way of electronics hooked up. With my recent "belts and braces" automation setup I have a lot more fryable bits hooked into my lighting rod....:eek:
 
As Jon said - it is possible but it is rare. When did you last have a television fried?
As for the extension lead - get as heavy a wire as they stock - 13 amp, not 5. etc.
 
You should be able to get some RG9 (M17/75-RG214) for free or a negligable cost for that short a length.

Just a thought...
 
I dont think that would be beefy enough, and why use co-ax - it wont protect from a nearby lightning strike.
 
stockers said:
As Jon said - it is possible but it is rare. When did you last have a television fried?
As for the extension lead - get as heavy a wire as they stock - 13 amp, not 5. etc.
Click to expand...

It will be 15 amp cable.

Hutch said:
You should be able to get some RG9 (M17/75-RG214) for free or a negligable cost for that short a length.

Just a thought...
Click to expand...

I am going for something heavier but the RG9 is usually available at a rock bottom price.
 
also, please do not forget that this is DCC, thus the "skin effect" is in play, so stranded cable will help and larger diameter (more strands) will help.

Signal integrity might require twisting the cable, not a lot but twist it to be sure. Not taking precautions on this long a run with a fair number of amps warrants good design.

If I had a dollar for every time someone took a short cut on foundational items, then bemoaned the result, and resisted "doing it over", welll I would be running only Aster steam locos.

Greg
 
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stockers said:
I dont think that would be beefy enough, and why use co-ax - it wont protect from a nearby lightning strike.
Click to expand...
It's 12.5 awg (approx 15 to 20 amp) and the thought was to eliminate phase shift problems.
Just a cheap thought.
 
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