A major change in plans

[tramcar trev]

I have been toying with this for a while, install on of these in each tramcar: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Wireless...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item5aeb672467&_uhb=1
We have discussed these at length ad nauseum....

Ok so what I am contemplating is turfing my sectionalised setup and equiping each of my cars with one of these.
Pros - each car would be individually controlled, Overhead would be at a constant 12v 15amps, the pcbs are about 45mm sq if taken out of the case, lights would be consantly on while the poles are in contact with the wire and of course speed control and stop start. My colour light staff would automatically control single track sections.... Around 6 tram tragics could have fun at the same time...
Cons - NO reverse unless I can find some way of doing it individually for each car which when trams run into the depot which is a stub terminus they would have to be physically turned around for their next run but then the driver, eeer sorry motorman is physically stuck to the No1 end anyway. My trams would only run on my track unless I made trailers with batteries in them for them to tow around.....Each car would also need its own circuit breaker.... I'd have to find 6 tram tragics to play trams with me, imagine trying to control 6 trams with 6 keyfobs at the same time?????
At this price and I can get 6 of these for $10.50 Im thinking it may be the way to go, each keyfob would have to be kept clipped to its coresponding car and numbered of course....

Thoughts from the floor chaps?

Edited to add this thought;
Reversing could be achieved with a small DPDT switch discreetly mounted on each tram between the output on the wireless control and the motor....maybe a dptd rotary switch under the floor actuated by the brake handle would work.... or going to extreme what do you think of this 3 channel bizzo; http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6Key-RGB...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1 < Link To http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6Key-RGB...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1 < Link To http://www.ebay.com.au/it...m51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1

Obviously has one 12v output and controls 3 negative outputs so I could control the motor, sound effects and lights....
A challenge for me to work through I think....

 

[Tony]

First impressions ..."not imprest" seems a bit of a bodge to have 6 keyfobs that may or may not do the job and the job they are going to try and do is only half what you wanted..... not sure i can come up with a better cost effective answer .....not much help but my experience of my railway is do it right first time other wise you will end up starting over

 

[tramcar trev]

First impressions ..."not imprest" seems a bit of a bodge to have 6 keyfobs that may or may not do the job and the job they are going to try and do is only half what you wanted..... not sure i can come up with a better cost effective answer .....not much help but my experience of my railway is do it right first time other wise you will end up starting over

Yes of course your right, "do it better, do it once".... Like you I have no other cost effective solution.... The key fob controllers will do the job within their design limitations and no way can I justify any of the other methods of radio control, the reciever boards cost more than each tram..... I've lashed out and bought the 3 channel one, ( has a 100metre range) if it dosen't work as a speed/ light/sound controller then I'll press it into service as a controller for lighting etc in my cinema when I build that...

 

[DoctorM]

Have you considered a physical approach to reversing the motor polarity?

I remember clock-work trains having a piece of metal dangling down underneath that operated the brake when it came in contact with an obstacle just above track level.

I wonder if the same approach might work if you had the DPDT switch underneath the tram operated by a hard but still flexible rubber obstacle at each reversing point. I know this would give an undesirable instant reverse to the drive, but it would be at very low speed if you were entering the terminus.

You would have to arrange things (maybe with a buffer stop) so that the switch could not pass right over the obstacle otherwise the tram would be constantly oscillating back and forth over the obstacle!

 

[Neil Robinson]

or going to extreme what do you think of this 3 channel bizzo; http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6Key-RGB...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1 < Link To http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6Key-RGB...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1 < Link To http://www.ebay.com.au/it...m51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1
Obviously has one 12v output and controls 3 negative outputs so I could control the motor, sound effects and lights....
A challenge for me to work through I think....

I've got one of those on order for experimental purposes. I hope to be able to use one channel for a DPCO reversing relay.

 

[Fairlie]

The fact that they can sell these items so cheaply shows what vast profits the DCC chip manufacturers are making. Electronics chips cost peanuts to make in quantity.

 

[DoctorM]

The fact that they can sell these items so cheaply shows what vast profits the DCC chip manufacturers are making. Electronics chips cost peanuts to make in quantity.

I agree they're expensive, but don't forget it's for a very limited marketplace. Someone has to do the R&D, design packaging marketing and warranty work, and get paid for it.

If you don't want to pay for DCC stick to analogue like I do, and enjoy yourself with magnets diodes and reed relays!

 

[DoctorM]

Trev,
A very simple solution, if you can accommodate it would be to have a very tight radius loop of track hidden behind the depot.

That way you just drive the tram into the depot, and it will re-appear shortly with the driver still at the front.

 

[lone ranger]

Hi Trev I don't know if this info on the mylargesale forum is of any use http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/aff/33/aft/128220/afv/topic/Default < Link To http://www.mylargescale.c...afv/topic/Default if you go down the posts about half way there is a description of the system and how it works.

Regards Jerry

Ps its for analogue not DCC

 

[Madman]

I bought one of those when we had our lengthy discussion on them, some time ago. Fiddled with it on the bench. Has lived in my parts drawer since, awaiting its call to duty, or not.

 

[Dtsteam]

Your good with circuit boards Trev, so could you come up with something like a DPDT rotary thingy that sat under the trolley pole such that when you swung the pole you reversed direction ? Trouble is, it doesn't solve the depot problem as you can't swing the trolley and back in.

 

[tramcar trev]

Well in the interests of research I have lashed out on the 3 channel job; http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/350687616075?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649 that would hopefully give me speed control as well as lighting and sound effects ( being handbrake trams there will only be a "ding ding" as the car moves off). As I have to swing the trolley pole to reverse anyway a discrete dpdt switch will do the job as suggested above. Automatic reverse is somewhat moot because I have to manually swing the poles anyway... I'm thinking that if I put the coupler onto the end of the switch toggle that would be discrete, the couplers on my trams are purely decorative...

This solves a few problems mainly voltage drop that I'm experiencing currently ( pardon the pun).
It could be the big GO as its cost effective and hopefully gives independant control of each tram....

 

[tramcar trev]

or going to extreme what do you think of this 3 channel bizzo; http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6Key-RGB...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1 < Link To http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6Key-RGB...t=AU_Lighting_Fans&hash=item51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1 < Link To http://www.ebay.com.au/it...m51a69c5c4b&_uhb=1
Obviously has one 12v output and controls 3 negative outputs so I could control the motor, sound effects and lights....
A challenge for me to work through I think....

I've got one of those on order for experimental purposes. I hope to be able to use one channel for a DPCO reversing relay.

Please keep us informed Neil... I have come to the realisation that as I have to physically swing/change the trolley pole anyway that a simple switch will suffice to swap polarity over for reverse... I'm not sure what these actually do the controls look interesting there is a B+ & - and an S+ & -.... I did communicate with the seller but got a response that was due to language difficulties non comprehendable... I hope it can be got out of its box as I only have room for the PCB...

 

[tramcar trev]

Trev,
A very simple solution, if you can accommodate it would be to have a very tight radius loop of track hidden behind the depot.

That way you just drive the tram into the depot, and it will re-appear shortly with the driver still at the front.

Hmmmmm all my radii are very tight, 250mm is the tightest 450mm is the widest.... Unfortunatley at this time I'm not allowed anymore extensions. Hyacinth does not approve...

 

[tramcar trev]

I bought one of those when we had our lengthy discussion on them, some time ago. Fiddled with it on the bench. Has lived in my parts drawer since, awaiting its call to duty, or not.

The MAJOR issue I have found is that these come with especially manufactured half dead batteries fitted. If its not responsive fit a decent battery.... All the keyfobs look identical but some take the A23's and some have lithium buttons, CR2035's in them.... Even the PCB's vary widley in the reciever/control box....

 

[andyspencer]

Just skimming through the thread, I dont think my idea has been mentioned - you mention you have 3 switched outputs for lighting and sound etc. Can you not connect a DPDT relay between the output and the motor wired like the DPDT switch. With the output off, the motor runs forward, and with the output on, turns the relay on, and reverses the motor.
Just a thought?

 

[steve parberry]

Proper radio as well so no sun light issues...only trouble is I bet they all work on the same frequency :wits::wits::wits: