What Scale?

trammayo

trammayo

Interested in vintage commercial vehicle, trams, t
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I'm just curious as to the scale of the Bachmann L& B loco 'Lyn' and the scale of the GRS coaches?

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The first coach is mounted on the correct trucks, whilst the second is on a pair of Bachmann trucks with standard diameter wheels - both items need some TLC (well quite a lot really) - I just put the trucks under because it came with only half of the correct one. I've now modified those B'mann trucks so the coach sits a little lower.
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
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389
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I have a pair of L&B bogies - the Tenmille kit, but they're intended for 32mm and require a different, scratch built bolster. They're sprung. PM me if you would like them.
 
Tony Walsham

Tony Walsham

Manufacturer of RCS Radio Control.
25 Oct 2009
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8
Casino, NSW
When Bachmann released the original "LYN" they claimed it to be 1:24 scale.
As the current version has an identical body to the old one, I guess it too would be 1:24 scale.
 
maxi-model

maxi-model

UK/US/ROW steam narrow gauge railways 1:1
27 Oct 2009
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The Bachmann Lyn is around 1:22.5 (sounds familiar ? - Spur 2). Sit it next to the Accucraft Lyn live steamer and the scale comparison becomes apparent. To confuse matters more the rest of the LS Spectrum range is marketed as 1:20.3 which has led some to believe that is its scale.

The GRS coaches are marketed as 16 mm but look slightly overscale next to the Accucraft made items, also marketed as 16 mm. I'd have to refer to my copy of L&B Measured and Drawn to be absolutely sure ;)

The Bachmann Lyn was one of the first locos I owned - now sold on. I still have the Accucraft live steamer and 3 of the GRS coaches too, that I built from kits. Note the GRS coaches are of a modular design and can be built in shorter than standard lengths by deleting complete compartments. They are of an all styrene construction - molded, vac formed and cut sheet. The side modules mount to a clear sided sheet styrene "box" with a heat formed roof attached. GRS bogies give the coaches the correct height and are molded styrene too. Max

Coach bogie kits are still listed at GRS as are some of the accessory packs used to add interior and surface detail, seats, lamp housings, running board hangers and vents. example - Coach Bogie L&B 45/32mm Kit | Garden Railway Specialists Tel:01844 345158 . I replaced the crude door handles supplied, wire you have to bend, with cast brass Tenmille items - Brandbright supply identical items too/


I have some spare vac form seat moldings if you would like them Mick.


You've got me going now - And here is my old Lyn, those trees in the background have grown a bit in the past 11 years.

123217_721db7e775b8042154769cf0386b69cd.jpg
 
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Tony Walsham

Tony Walsham

Manufacturer of RCS Radio Control.
25 Oct 2009
2,109
8
Casino, NSW
Now how did I get that so wrong. I know. I got up too early this morning so I was not fully awake when I answered the question.
My apologies. 1:22.5 it is.
 
trammayo

trammayo

Interested in vintage commercial vehicle, trams, t
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Tony - I get up too early every day! It's all confusing to me - a nominal 2ft gauge loco running on metre-gauge track - even 'O' gauge track would be oversize! :banghead:

Max - I'm confused as to which parts are ventilators and which are the lamp access vents! I'll have to take a piccy of the roof and put it on here. I did have a look at GRS yesterday but was not much wiser! They do two different length rooves which set me wondering (or wandering).

My next thought would be to shorten the long coach (I don't need two brake thirds!) but I cannot find any broadside views of the passenger stock! Maybe I should stick to the tried and tested US stuff - I just thought it would be nice to run something that resembled (in some ways) the C & L!

Anyway thenk you both for your replies and I'll be in touch Max (just got some domestic logistical problems at the mo!).
 
maxi-model

maxi-model

UK/US/ROW steam narrow gauge railways 1:1
27 Oct 2009
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PM me Mick and I'll try to answer as many of your questions as I can :) Roofs are 576 x 101 mm. A little pic to help you out for starters - Lamps are the ones on the left, vents on the right of the pairs shown. And a little of the end detail too. The original coaches were built by Pickerings and similar designs of theirs showed up on a number of narrow gauge railways, e.g. the WHR. So your observation of creating something that was reminiscent to the C&L is maybe not far off the mark.

GRS might be able to supply the coach side module panels to you as a separate item. They must surely have a few lying around. They still list these kits which use the same side panels used to make up the L&B sets COACH BODY FREELANCE 3 COMP KIT | Garden Railway Specialists Tel:01844 345158 ;) That's what I call getting full value from one's tooling - I did the same when I had my model business. Max

123223_76aa7d9e119d5ace683293393b490c32.jpg


Looks like your green one has been built 1 compartment short from "prototypical". I counted the door handles ;)

As luck would have it (or as is my analy retentive wont :D ) I still have all the GRS build manuals for all 3 variants of the L&B coach kits they made. You are welcome to them, probably a good reference to use before you "deconstruct" them and seek replacement or additional parts .


They show how they are constructed and how the differing "modules" for the sides are configured and modified, if needed. They include (for once) some decent schematics. You could by acquiring one of their "freelance" kits reconstruct one of your brakes to a full length 3rd class or even the observation version. Then again you may want to "freelance" and shorten the lot :wasntme:

123225_4017d7571e7aa6d0560675ee2d0e1097.jpg
 
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trammayo

trammayo

Interested in vintage commercial vehicle, trams, t
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Hi Max, I've just taken a couple of pics (inbetween checking on the goats!) .....

123235_a05c995f991347d882256554d15d6c41.jpg

THe long one is as you say 576mm. If I shorten it I would want it around the same size as the shorter one (at around 500mm).

What I cannot ascertain from the pic on the GRS site (of a bag with six ventilators) in it) is which is which ....

123237_7af90f646b92d5b4aed2f3e2ef33ba6e.jpg


The missing ones on the shorter roof are the "squared off" ones whilst the ones in the GRS bag seem to be round - it's the latter observation I'd like to sort out!

And yes, the build manuals would be great!

I'll PM you later - got to go down to the Pump House to record the water readings and monitor checking!
 
P

Paradise

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28 Jan 2010
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I think on average, it is close to 1:22.5 or thereabouts.
I can't remember the specific details but it's proportions are different to the Lyn prototype. I think the cab is little too wide, the tanks sit different and overall a few feet short.

Strangely enough the original model had an outer sleeve marked as Spectrum but is about 1:22.5 and the later much improved model which is the same scale was Boxed as Big Hauler and marketed as 1:20.3.
The pre-release photo had the 2 together with the later one closer so it looked bigger and it was claimed to be 1:20.3 :nerd:
1st rule of successful marketing: BS baffles brains. :think:
 
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P

Paul M

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25 Oct 2016
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Well I suppose if LGB can do Stretchy Scale, I suppose Bachmann can too!
I have both the Bachmann and Accucraft Lyns, the differences are what you would expect fromantic a relatively expensive and relatively cheap loco. Both excellent products for what they are.
PS, has anyone has a spare motor kicking around suitable for a Bachmann Lyn? I'm a loathe to order one from the States as I imagine the postage would cost more than a new engine.
 
maxi-model

maxi-model

UK/US/ROW steam narrow gauge railways 1:1
27 Oct 2009
4,481
131
Bucks/Oxon/Northants area
What I cannot ascertain from the pic on the GRS site (of a bag with six ventilators) in it) is which is which ....

View attachment 252037

The missing ones on the shorter roof are the "squared off" ones whilst the ones in the GRS bag seem to be round - it's the latter observation I'd like to sort out!
You are in luck the ones still on sale are the squared off "ventilators". They also still sell the vac formed panels that will allow you to adapt one of the brakes to the "ob's"" coach if you wish. You will need the manuals to make sure you can and how to actually do it and that you get everything in the right order. It's quite easy to get confused and screw up - don't ask me how I know :banghead: You need to check how well the coach side panels have been mounted to the clear sides of the coach base "box" construction, before you start, to see how easily it can be reconstructed. Remember these are all styrene components, injection molded, vac formed and flat sheet. If they have been assembled properly with a solvent to "weld" the parts together it might not be so easy to reconfigure them. Though not impossible. just hope the original builder has used super glue, UHU, contact adhesive or epoxy :D . Max
 
Rhinochugger

Rhinochugger

Retired Oik
27 Oct 2009
24,713
389
North West Norfolk
I think on average, it is close to 1:22.5 or thereabouts.
I can't remember the specific details but it's proportions are different to the Lyn prototype. I think the cab is little too wide, the tanks sit different and overall a few feet short.

Strangely enough the original model had an outer sleeve marked as Spectrum but is about 1:22.5 and the later much improved model which is the same scale was Boxed as Big Hauler and marketed as 1:20.3.
The pre-release photo had the 2 together with the later one closer so it looked bigger and it was claimed to be 1:20.3 :nerd:
1st rule of successful marketing: BS baffles brains. :think:
I seem to remember some previous debate about the actual scale of this loco - particularly as the second release also included a US variant :think::think:

Couldn't remember the answer though :confused:
 
P

Paradise

Registered
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Some could argue that the US variant of the model could be of a standard Baldwin design and larger scale. :think: Chicken or egg, I dunno.
 
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trammayo

trammayo

Interested in vintage commercial vehicle, trams, t
24 Oct 2009
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You are in luck the ones still on sale are the squared off "ventilators". They also still sell the vac formed panels that will allow you to adapt one of the brakes to the "ob's"" coach if you wish. You will need the manuals to make sure you can and how to actually do it and that you get everything in the right order. It's quite easy to get confused and screw up - don't ask me how I know :banghead: You need to check how well the coach side panels have been mounted to the clear sides of the coach base "box" construction, before you start, to see how easily it can be reconstructed. Remember these are all styrene components, injection molded, vac formed and flat sheet. If they have been assembled properly with a solvent to "weld" the parts together it might not be so easy to reconfigure them. Though not impossible. just hope the original builder has used super glue, UHU, contact adhesive or epoxy :D . Max
PM sent!

By the look of the coach it is covered in glue/solvent. You haven't got a link to the ventilators have you?

Thanks very much.
 
trammayo

trammayo

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M

Michael

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26 Jan 2010
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Here they are side by side:

123281_aa0d5d08feb71abf58f2b6f93e4f3c68.jpg
 

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RogerK

Registered
3 Jun 2018
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1
USA
The scale of the current Bachman’s Lyn has been discussed before. Bachman claims a 1:20.3 (Fn3) scale, but the model is primarily a generic US Baldwin tank loco with an “anglicized” version offered as the L&B Lyn. As such, a lot of the proportions and detailare different from the actual Lyn. Compared to the Lyn, it is roughly 1:20.3 in height and width, but 1:22.5 in length. Disagreement over scale really seems to depend on which dimension matters to different people. To me, what really matters is how it looks with my rolling stock and it scales really well visually with my Accucraft wagons and vans. If I had the Accucraft passengers cars, I would probably feel it was too small even though the height differences would probably be correct.
 
trammayo

trammayo

Interested in vintage commercial vehicle, trams, t
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Definite differences in Michael's photo! Rubber ruler rules?

I agree with Roger - it's what it looks like together with stock!
 
G

gnm109

Registered
As pointed out here, Bachmann and LGB are close to one another but USA Trains looked out of place on my layout which is all LGB engines. The Bachmann freight cars are excellent for an American themed Model Railroad as well. I have a few Aristo-Craft freight cars that look somewhat smaller than they should but one of them is a track cleaning maintenance caboose so it stays.