Adobe Photoshop Pricing

whatlep

whatlep

Registered
24 Oct 2009
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Worcestershire
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I assume that nobody believes that when they pay money for a deckchair at the beach, they suddenly own it?
Of course not, that is a rental agreement for a specified time, a whole other kettle of fish.
Sorry, but they are exactly the same. An agreement to use something with terms attached. If you don't want to accept the terms, don't buy the item. It really is extremely simple.

Has anybody noticed that in your nice new Android device, the agreement you accept when first registering the device has exactly the same terms as a Microsoft licence in respect of ownership, resale and copying? In other words, you can't. If you have a Samsung Galaxy device it's in the Legal section under Settings. As a user, I was expressly asked to agree to those terms on first activating the smartphone and given the choice of returning the device if I wished not to agree.
 
bobg

bobg

Registered
3 May 2010
20,141
0
Middle Earth
I assume that nobody believes that when they pay money for a deckchair at the beach, they suddenly own it?
Of course not, that is a rental agreement for a specified time, a whole other kettle of fish.
Sorry, but they are exactly the same. An agreement to use something with terms attached. If you don't want to accept the terms, don't buy the item. It really is extremely simple.
I don't agree, when I rent a deck-chair I don't get to walk off with part of it. With the software I bought recently I got a disc, with everything on it. That disc is mine, including everything on it, so technically I've bought it, not rented/licenced it.

The majority of people don't care about the whys and wherefores; as long as they get to use what they're after. They don't even understand that all it is, is a licence, and not an outright purchase, they just tick the box coz if you don't it doesn't work, and who the hell is going to read all that claptrap, and understand the legalese, when it's up on a p.c. screen in letters that you can hardly see never mind discern. It's all perfectly legal, but is it moral? I suspect very borderline. It's just an excuse for powerful industry to have even more control of your lives and wallets.

People don't want to hear these things, they just want what they want, and they want it NOW.

And I don't have an Android phone or other device, nor will I.
 
lone ranger

lone ranger

Trams, Southern region BR & USA steam G Scale
I use a lot of software for my weathersatellite activities.
Most of it is written by a very nice chap who does it for a living.
As well as locking paid for software to one PC he also lets users have
limited software as well.
He goes the extra mile on back up as well and always replies to queries.
Free is ok but remember some people need to make a living out of it.
I have no objection to anyone making a living from software or anything else, but when there is no need to pay over the odds to use software I wont pay it, nor will I make pirate copies of software but thats another issue
 
E

Enginehouse

Amateur Radio, 16mm/G scale railways
24 Oct 2009
570
0
Peterborough
Android is Linux. It can be freely be copied and used on any device free of charge. Apple Machines no matter what they call the operating system now is still based on FreeBSD (the name of that should provide a clue). The agreements with new machines only covers that particular installation on that machine at that time. Linux cannot be sold or leased full stop. See the various licenses with regard to free software. A large number of user maintained devices have operating systems that have been modified. Indeed I would never ever use any equipment that is crippled by some kind of lock in legal or otherwise. Many Linux, freeBSD and UNIX programmes are considerably better than anything provided specifically tailored for MS systems. Most of the servers on the Internet are Linux or BSD boxes. I run five machines of varying types including two servers. And all Linux based phones. We do not have an MS box on the network. Far too risky. Never understood why people pay for software.
 
lone ranger

lone ranger

Trams, Southern region BR & USA steam G Scale
I think we all accept that 'free' is only free to the user, it is paid for by the advertising that it carries
with it. I don't have a problem with that, but I don't necessarily want it everywhere. Flashing ads particularly are a distraction.
[/quote]

Open source software does not have adverts in it. Its not shareware as you may be used to on Windows. It is software wirten by pepole who enjoy writing software for their and others use.
 
whatlep

whatlep

Registered
24 Oct 2009
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People don't want to hear these things, they just want what they want, and they want it NOW.
You make my case even more elegantly than I could myself.
 
lone ranger

lone ranger

Trams, Southern region BR & USA steam G Scale
Android is Linux. It can be freely be copied and used on any device free of charge. Apple Machines no matter what they call the operating system now is still based on FreeBSD (the name of that should provide a clue). The agreements with new machines only covers that particular installation on that machine at that time. Linux cannot be sold or leased full stop. See the various licenses with regard to free software. A large number of user maintained devices have operating systems that have been modified. Indeed I would never ever use any equipment that is crippled by some kind of lock in legal or otherwise. Many Linux, freeBSD and UNIX programmes are considerably better than anything provided specifically tailored for MS systems. Most of the servers on the Internet are Linux or BSD boxes. I run five machines of varying types including two servers. And all Linux based phones. We do not have an MS box on the network. Far too risky. Never understood why people pay for software.
Quite so and better put than me :clap:
 
bobg

bobg

Registered
3 May 2010
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0
Middle Earth
People don't want to hear these things, they just want what they want, and they want it NOW.
You make my case even more elegantly than I could myself.
Yes Peter, but you do also need to understand the previous para. I can be eloquent when required.
 
lgbmad

lgbmad

Model trains....G scale mainly, but enjoy all othe
20 Oct 2011
1,084
3
Llanfyllin,Powys
Hi all
well for me I use Serif Photoplus x 6, its a fraction of the cost of Photoshop and does pretty much the same sort of thing. It certainly does more than I could ever hope to use (or learn). All the other software from Serif is great to.
 
beavercreek

beavercreek

Travel, Art, Theatre, Music, Photography, Trains
24 Oct 2009
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70
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In my dark past I was an IT (ICT) consultant to schools and part of that remit was to offer advice on software, equipment and infrastructure etc. I looked after schools that were not part of the Research Machines stranglehold. RM were a good firm but were pricey as well. My main area was for Apple Mac but about 80% of the schools that I supported were PC with Windows.
Well a lot of educational software was developed by good folk who wanted to make something really useful for teaching etc but also wanted to make a living as well.They would not have been able to go on develop better or different products if they had just done it for free.

I have always held the belief that if you pay peanuts you get shells all over the place.......The big software companies do make an awful lot of money from the purchasers (of the leases) but also if they did not get paid a fairly good whack they would not be able to develop good features that we now take for granted. It is true that some have gone on to just create 'bloat' while others have refined the software to the point where it is damn spot on.
Most, and I say most, free software was developed after a similar commercial package included features that were desirable that then could be 'copied' or 'modelled on' to include in a free version.
Most, and I say again most 'free' software does include a request for donation or maybe just a cut-down version to try before paying a small amount to 'unlock' all the features......how many folk actually do pay that small amount.......not many, so there is a little hypocrisy about not paying the 'big boys' and plumping for 'free' or 'shareware'.
 
E

Enginehouse

Amateur Radio, 16mm/G scale railways
24 Oct 2009
570
0
Peterborough
Never found a Linux operating system installation - including all of the other associated software packages that has requested money in any form as payment for download or use, some companies however charge for providing a compiled CD set, but there is no charge for the software and no user licence. The original freeware licence does not allow that. Support can be offered under some sort of contract but that is all.

Most shareware is based on MS operating systems and so can be crippled until a licence fee is paid. As for copying MS systems or software, KDE for example is several years ahead of MS and always has been. MS still does not have full multitasking capability which Linux/UNIX have both had for many years (like 20).

Just checked my laptop. Under the menu heading "graphics" there are 22 stand alone program's ready to run, including Gimp, ImageMagik and Panorama. All part of the initial op system download and free to use, lend or modify to individual taste. It is the latest PClinux op system on the machine.
 
pugwash

pugwash

impecunious pirate
17 Nov 2009
14,485
250
56
Luxembourg
Something you seem to have so far missed is that the full version of PS isn't for the likes of us but is the industry standard for the graphics and printing industries who laugh at £47.
I still use PSE 5 on my XP computer, and then only to open RAW files to convert (I see it cost a heady £50 in 2006 and was sold subject to acceptance of the licence agreement), all the rest is not needed. PSE 6 came as standard on the slaptop but I can't get it to accept the RAW code so it only gets used as a backup device when out & about. So PSE 5 and Pantone Colorvision colorplus to tune the monitor, that's all I need. More pennies for G!
 
beavercreek

beavercreek

Travel, Art, Theatre, Music, Photography, Trains
24 Oct 2009
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East Anglia
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Something you seem to have so far missed is that the full version of PS isn't for the likes of us but is the industry standard for the graphics and printing industries who laugh at £47.
Sorry pugwash but 'by the likes of us' I have to differ as, speaking for myself, I sell my photographs and other design work, so to that end I use Photoshop 12 (part of the CS5 package pretty extensively and Plug-ins like Mask-Pro and Perfect-resize etc. PSE is very good indeed but does not provide the full kit that I like to use.
I also use Aperture (Apple's alternative to Lightroom) one hell of a lot so some software packages are necessary.................
But as I said before I will be sticking with CS5 for a long time.
 
pugwash

pugwash

impecunious pirate
17 Nov 2009
14,485
250
56
Luxembourg
Okay, my mistake and there are one or two pro's that do need the full spec here, but for most PSE or an early full PS will do. Sorry. :D
 
Martino

Martino

Kit bashing, The UK narrow gauge, The GWR, Aviatio
Oh dear, what a can of worms.

You use the software that works for YOU.

Do I need to buy a new plane for smoothing wood, or is the one my late Father gave me 40 years ago good enough? I rarely plane wood, so yes it is. On the other hand I do use my iPad and iMac (and MacBook Pro) for a huge range of important business tasks. It's important (to me) that they are the best, state of the art, I can get. Same with software. I hate, with a passion, MS office but in order to communicate with my colleagues I HAVE to have the same version that they have. I don't often use Photoshop, so my existing version will suffice. Aperture is a different matter. I NEED the best I can get to do my work.

Did I need Apple's photo stream? No. But having got it, I now would find it difficult to live without it. ....in my business. It makes my life easier.

It's all horses for courses. What works for you, may not work for others and v.v.

As for 'setting up' email in Mac OS or iOS as opposed to MS OS. Sorry, but it doesn't need to set up like MS. It 'just does it'. Same as finding wifi networks. Mac OS and iOS 'just find them', MS OS does not.

Rant over, I'm going back to my beer ;-)
 
beavercreek

beavercreek

Travel, Art, Theatre, Music, Photography, Trains
24 Oct 2009
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70
East Anglia
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The average modeller on GSC I imagine, really only wants a program for decal making
Which brings me back to my earlier post....first sentence.

"I should imagine that the majority of PC users would only occasionally use a Photoshop type program (taking into consideration cost). Freebies should suffice."

Business users are a different kettle of fish altogether. Their livelihood may depend on these expensive programs.
Yes and that probably applies to Mac users too... I am a confirmed Mac-o-phile since 1985 but had to support institutions using PCs for quite a few years, so I have had much experience of the two platforms......that is why I use Macs.

It just happens that I, like some others on the forum, use the software for business and pleasure.... but even if I was not using it for business I would still go for the 'real' Photoshop with Aperture for my own photography. Now that 3-D photography is not fantasy anymore it is good to have a solid piece of software to handle it.
Sure, some cheaper/free/shareware programs are great (PSE being the best one) and are definitely more than good enough for 'decals' and they will catch up and have features to equate fairly closely to 'Shop' but, for me personally, once you have tasted [strike]Mac,[/strike] sorry, Photoshop, there's no going back :happy:
 
bobg

bobg

Registered
3 May 2010
20,141
0
Middle Earth
su root
cd /
chmod - R ug+o 666

That should make it interesting. :)
Assume the identity of the "system owner" (root)
Change directory to the root of the directory tree
Change / Modify recursively
Stuck with the fact that you've used "ug+o" to change file properties as well as "666" (all users can read and write but do not execute)?

8|
 
spike

spike

It's me
su root
cd /
chmod - R ug+o 666

That should make it interesting. :)
This is interesting.
traceroute 216.81.59.173

windoze users try
tracert -h 100 216.81.59.173